| re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera | |
| Posted by: | mamaleh 07:15 pm EDT 09/13/14 |
| In reply to: | CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - Alcindoro 02:02 pm EDT 09/13/14 |
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| Big difference there. Figaro is a fictional character. Klinghoffer, the subject of THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER, was an elderly wheelchair-bound Jewish man whose "death" was more accurately targeted murder by a Palestinian terror group. What's more, with so much fear of terrorist recruitment in the US, it's probably not the wisest move to present an opera, whatever its artistic merits, that according to those familiar with the libretto, presents terrorists in anything resembling a heroic light and further fuels the Judeopathic insanity current taking hold of much of the world. | |
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| re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera | |
| Posted by: | enoch10 12:20 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
| In reply to: | re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - mamaleh 07:15 pm EDT 09/13/14 |
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| this post is exactly why this opera DOES need to be performed. this kind of simplistic spin held sway for too many years and did too much damage domestically and internationally. the people opposing gelb's decision to have KLINGHOFFER performed misunderstand the cause and the symptom. the genie is out of the bottle, the toothpaste out of the tube and there's no going back to believing events on this scale are black and white. they're more complicated and the world isn't just catching on it's caught on. stopping a production of this opera won't get the genie back in the bottle or the toothpaste back in the tube. it's not often i find myself defending a decision by peter gelb and it doesn't alter one whit my conviction that gelb's gotta go. but for this - i applaud him. | |
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| re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera | |
| Posted by: | truefan 12:49 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
| In reply to: | re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - enoch10 12:20 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
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| Please explain how it's ever acceptable to push a wheelchair bound man overboard and I'll agree. I don't care about the rational. After you do that explain how you behead a man on a video. OK you hate America. You had an unhappy childhood in the U.K. Is that enough reason? | |
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| re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera | |
| Posted by: | AlanScott 04:18 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
| In reply to: | re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - truefan 12:49 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
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| I'm not seeing that anyone said it was ever acceptable to push a wheelchair-bound man overboard. | |
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| re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera | |
| Posted by: | LegitOnce 01:52 am EDT 09/16/14 |
| In reply to: | re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - AlanScott 04:18 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
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| I believe that was in the second act of The Man Who Came to Dinner. | |
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| re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera | |
| Posted by: | enoch10 01:41 pm EDT 09/15/14 |
| In reply to: | re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - AlanScott 04:18 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
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| this is EXACTLY why that kind of logic works. well, if you approve of a production of KLINGHOFFER then you support throwing a wheel-chair bound man overboard. and for years and years and years this kind of "logic" held sway. it is only very recently that people have spoken up and gone, wait - this is more complicated than that. and that is what terrifies the people who've tried - and until very recently succeeded - to control the parameters of the discussion. which is exactly what these protests are. that's why art is so transgressive. questions can be asked and lights can be shined on previously unexamined aspects of things. and for the folks who want to keep discussions like this as binary (we're good and they're bad) as possible and simple (we're always right and they're always wrong) as possible this is a very real threat. as art - even now - can be. they're right to object. as james dickey used to say - it's the stuck pig who squeals. | |
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| re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera | |
| Posted by: | whereismikeyfl 07:31 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
| In reply to: | re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - AlanScott 04:18 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
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| I think this action is so far beyond what anyone can imagine as acceptable that no journalistic account can explain it. It takes a novel or opera to give us any idea of who the people are who did this action. Maybe it is just me, but any understanding I have of how people do horrible things comes from artistic works rather than straightforward reporting. | |
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| re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera | |
| Posted by: | JohnDunlop 08:08 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
| In reply to: | re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - whereismikeyfl 07:31 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
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| "Maybe it is just me, but any understanding I have of how people do horrible things comes from artistic works rather than straightforward reporting." Just one example. There was excellent reporting on the Malaysian plane crash in eastern Ukraine by regular journalists and freelancers, including from the crash scene on YouTube. I understand your point, when the situation is more complicated than the war in Ukraine, but you are still making a sweeping statement. For the record, I am strongly against the protest at the Met over Klinghoffer. | |
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| re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera | |
| Posted by: | truefan 07:42 pm EDT 09/13/14 |
| In reply to: | re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - mamaleh 07:15 pm EDT 09/13/14 |
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| Beautifully put. Thank you. | |
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| re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera | |
| Posted by: | enoch10 12:29 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
| In reply to: | re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - truefan 07:42 pm EDT 09/13/14 |
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| i'm curious. have you seen this opera or are you just agreeing because ...well, for whatever reason? | |
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| re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera | |
| Posted by: | Zelgo 09:10 pm EDT 09/13/14 |
| In reply to: | re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - truefan 07:42 pm EDT 09/13/14 |
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| You all have obviously never seen Klinghoffer or read its libretto. What it does it is treat all the characters, Klinghoffer and his killers, as complete human beings. Yes, his killers aren't treated as crazy people who kill for no reason--they have a point-of-view. You may disagree with what the killers think and feel at least it doesn't treat them as cardboard characters. CATO's real motive is to prevent the Palestinians to have a voice at all. | |
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| re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera | |
| Posted by: | Alcindoro 12:28 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
| In reply to: | re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - Zelgo 09:10 pm EDT 09/13/14 |
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| This interesting, level-headed debate on KLINGHOFFER was telecast on the occasion of the English National Opera production only two years ago. An occasion which passed, by the way, with little or no adverse public incident. | |
| Link | Frontline Debates 2012 KLINGHOFFER |
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| re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera | |
| Posted by: | MockingbirdGirl 01:18 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
| In reply to: | re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - Alcindoro 12:28 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
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| Without getting emeshed in further debate, the English perspective on Palestine is rather different from the American perspective. It is not surprising that reactions to the opera are similarly different. | |
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| re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera | |
| Posted by: | Alcindoro 02:29 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
| In reply to: | re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - MockingbirdGirl 01:18 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
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| No doubt, and that's probably what allows this particular debate to be conducted in a calm and informative manner. I'd be very happy to see a similar forum on the subject broadcast or available online. In the meantime, Opera News offers this thoughtful piece by Philip Kennicott on the subject. | |
| Link | Opera News: A Work Divided |
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| re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera | |
| Posted by: | AlanScott 04:18 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
| In reply to: | re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - Alcindoro 02:29 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
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| Thanks for the link. A well-written piece. | |
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| Thanks, I'll check it out (nm) | |
| Posted by: | MockingbirdGirl 02:42 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
| In reply to: | re: CATO to protest THE DEATH OF KLINGHOFFER @ Met Opera - Alcindoro 02:29 pm EDT 09/14/14 |
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