| re: John Simon on FUN HOME and the "Demented Tonys" | |
| Posted by: | TGWW 07:31 pm EDT 05/06/15 |
| In reply to: | John Simon on FUN HOME and the "Demented Tonys" - bwayjoey 12:10 pm EDT 05/06/15 |
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| I'm confused. Could someone please inform me what the difference between Simon's review of "Fun Home" and Nothinglikeashow80's proud evisceration of "Finding Neverland" posted below with post after post of huzzahs? | |
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| Agree with his review: and THE VISIT wins BEST MUSICAL | |
| Posted by: | Draeigon 04:19 am EDT 05/07/15 |
| In reply to: | re: John Simon on FUN HOME and the "Demented Tonys" - TGWW 07:31 pm EDT 05/06/15 |
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| I don't know... not a big John Simon fan but I do feel in line with his review of Fun Home. From two sources, I have heard that Fun Home and The Visit were the two clear nominees after the first round of TONY nominee voting and that Something Rotten is lucky to be in the race. I do not know but...that is the word from 2 sources. I have already posted about this so forgive me but I love the underdog story. Why will/can THE VISIT win? For me, this has not been a terribly exciting year for musicals and this is the one occasion that everyone can throw their hands in the air and vote for the most ambitious and compelling work of art. This is a year when voters can honor a disappearing musical landscape on Broadway. I am surprised at the amount of true admiration and support that I am hearing for the show. There is a definite sense that the industy is rallying around it. I think that every so often people are going to support artistic integrity over commerce. This is the year voters,at least many that I am talking to, are planning on doing just that. FUN HOME does not seem to be connecting with voters and American in Paris is putting every voter I know to sleep. Personaly, I thought the dancing was great, the book and performances generic. Fun Home, was very moving but formulaic with a limited universal perspective. S. ROTTEN was just a silly, underdeveloped grab bag filled with the same joke. Funny to a point but utterly negligible. I know...everyone (outsiders?) is saying that there is no chance for THE VISIT To take the big one. Maybe that is the truth. However, that is seriously, not what I am hearing. I will not be surprised if this is the year that the voters honor something that truly does not fit the Broadway ideal. WHY? Because people in this industy want to believe in their artistry and intellect. With a bevy of mediocre choices this is the year they can vote for "art". THE VISIT seems to be one of those shows that people passionately love or dismiss. Maybe I am a chump for getting caught up in the TONY game but I would so love to see this industry give it's top award to the show that reflects ideals of art rather than pandering to the possible lining of their pocketbooks. Ok, I am going g o. Too long and it is late. I love the show but I love my zzzzzzz's better. Nite. | |
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| re: Agree with his review: and THE VISIT wins BEST MUSICAL | |
| Posted by: | AlanScott 09:43 am EDT 05/07/15 |
| In reply to: | Agree with his review: and THE VISIT wins BEST MUSICAL - Draeigon 04:19 am EDT 05/07/15 |
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| "Fun Home, was very moving but formulaic with a limited universal perspective." There are many possible criticisms of Fun Home, I am sure, but formulaic does not seem to me one of them. What do you perceive as being formulaic about it? As ryhog said, there is only one round of Tony voting. Here is the rule on this matter: "Where there are nine or more eligible shows in a Best Show category, at the Tony Nominating Meeting, the Nominating Committee will be instructed to cast one vote each for four eligible shows as nominees on his/her secret ballot. Such ballot shall be collected and tabulated by a representative of the Accounting Firm. The four eligible shows with the highest number of votes will automatically be designated as the nominees in such category. A fifth nominee shall be added to the category in the event that the Accounting Firm determines that the difference in votes between the fourth highest ranked show and the fifth highest ranked show is three votes or less." Tony rules and regulations are linked below. | |
| Link | Tony Rules and Regulations |
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| re: Agree with his review: and THE VISIT wins BEST MUSICAL | |
| Posted by: | Draeigon 07:05 pm EDT 05/07/15 |
| In reply to: | re: Agree with his review: and THE VISIT wins BEST MUSICAL - AlanScott 09:43 am EDT 05/07/15 |
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| Sorry, maybe I was wrong referencing voting rounds...may have heard it wrong. Point being the two top vote getters were apparently F.HOME and VISIT.Though,I can not validate the people that said it nor do I know how they knew. Perhaps, best to have Said nothing. At any rate, and this is just personal taste here, the use of the narrator seems a fairly eas way into a story. It is is a structural device that has been done to death. That is what stuck me as somewhat formulaic about Kron's book. However, as I believe I said, Fun Home was a fine, compelling show in my opinion, reservations aside I hate to say it, in response to the post after yours, as much as I am revolted by john Simons hate based references, I do think he understands structure and exhibits a fair amount of intellegence. There was another critic who I believe has passed away. His name was Martin Gottfried. Smart critic, Hideous human being.... at least to the degree he revealed himself in his notices. Don't get it. They are New York Theater critics. Guess hate can live anywhere | |
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| re: Agree with his review: and THE VISIT wins BEST MUSICAL | |
| Posted by: | AlanScott 11:24 pm EDT 05/08/15 |
| In reply to: | re: Agree with his review: and THE VISIT wins BEST MUSICAL - Draeigon 07:05 pm EDT 05/07/15 |
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| My take on Simon: He has a lot of knowledge, but little insight. My take on Gottfried: He had some knowledge, but he understood very little indeed about anything. Perhaps he was an early champion of Sondheim, at one time I thought he had smart taste. The more I read of his work, the less I thought of him. Unlike Walter Kerr (always an easy name to cite), with whom I often disagreed, but who I thought was both smart and knowledgeable. | |
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| Walter Kerr | |
| Posted by: | Draeigon 11:40 pm EDT 05/08/15 |
| In reply to: | re: Agree with his review: and THE VISIT wins BEST MUSICAL - AlanScott 11:24 pm EDT 05/08/15 |
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| An Kerr I thought was just a damn dood writer. Frequently disagreed with him as well but very articulate and often blisteringlyfunny. He was great at substantiating his position. I wrote a college paper on the demise of the Boulevard Comedy in relation to TV and read all of his play reviews in the 60's. If you can find it, read his opening paragraphs on a completely forgotten little thing called ONCE FOR THE ASKING. It is hilarious and creates such a vivid impression of what that evening in the theater must have been like. | |
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| re: Agree with his review: and THE VISIT wins BEST MUSICAL | |
| Posted by: | enoch10 06:04 pm EDT 05/08/15 |
| In reply to: | re: Agree with his review: and THE VISIT wins BEST MUSICAL - Draeigon 07:05 pm EDT 05/07/15 |
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| you find FUN HOME formulaic because it has a narrator? | |
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| re: Agree with his review: and THE VISIT wins BEST MUSICAL | |
| Posted by: | ryhog 08:54 am EDT 05/07/15 |
| In reply to: | Agree with his review: and THE VISIT wins BEST MUSICAL - Draeigon 04:19 am EDT 05/07/15 |
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| 1. Your 2 "sources" have as much chance of being right as the thousands of other "sources" for each of the nominees winning. Truth is, this is a category in which there is a plausible scenario for each show winning. 2. There is only one round of voting for the Tony. 3. Your art vs commerce discussion is made with blinders on. Whether you hated it or not, Fun Home undoubtedly falls in the "art" category. In general, I don't think this is a good year to make the distinction between art and commerce. 4. The Visit's biggest issue is staying open until the Tonys; notwithstanding your affection for it, which I certainly respect (although I'd prefer if you found someone other than a bigot to align yourself with), the show is bleeding big time money. | |
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| re: John Simon on FUN HOME and the "Demented Tonys" | |
| Posted by: | AlanScott (AlanScottG@aol.com) 08:07 pm EDT 05/06/15 |
| In reply to: | re: John Simon on FUN HOME and the "Demented Tonys" - TGWW 07:31 pm EDT 05/06/15 |
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| I haven't read Simon's review. I'm not going to click on it and give it more hits. But I'm guessing that one reason is that nothinglikeashow80 makes some valid points about Finding Neverland's shortcomings, whereas Simon's displeasure with Fun Home is considered to be coming from a place of homophobia and his criticisms are largely invalid. And that's not to say that there can't be valid criticisms of the show. I loved it, but I could criticize some elements of it, as I could about almost any musical that's ever been written. Did you think that any of Simon's criticisms were valid? Perhaps I should read it, but I just can't bring myself to click on it. | |
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| Awwwww... | |
| Posted by: | jimvar1 03:03 am EDT 05/07/15 |
| In reply to: | re: John Simon on FUN HOME and the "Demented Tonys" - AlanScott 08:07 pm EDT 05/06/15 |
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| click on it, Alan. C'mon, we won't tell!! ;-) | |
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| re: Awwwww... | |
| Posted by: | AlanScott 10:08 am EDT 05/07/15 |
| In reply to: | Awwwww... - jimvar1 03:03 am EDT 05/07/15 |
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| LOL. It's not that you'll tell. They'll know how many hits he gets. But I think I probably will click on it later today. | |
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| re: Awwwww... | |
| Posted by: | oddone 11:31 am EDT 05/07/15 |
| In reply to: | re: Awwwww... - AlanScott 10:08 am EDT 05/07/15 |
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| No need to click- I just emailed you the review | |
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| re: Awwwww... | |
| Posted by: | AlanScott 11:50 am EDT 05/07/15 |
| In reply to: | re: Awwwww... - oddone 11:31 am EDT 05/07/15 |
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| Thank you. (That's why I put my email address there. You were smart enough to figure it out. Very silly of me, I know.) | |
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| re: Awwwww... | |
| Posted by: | larry13 12:04 pm EDT 05/07/15 |
| In reply to: | re: Awwwww... - AlanScott 11:50 am EDT 05/07/15 |
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| I cannot help but think this is the equivalent of having a Shabbos goy press the elevator button for you!(Absolutely no offense intended.) | |
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| re: Awwwww... | |
| Posted by: | AlanScott 12:42 pm EDT 05/07/15 |
| In reply to: | re: Awwwww... - larry13 12:04 pm EDT 05/07/15 |
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| LOL. I never remember to ask goys to do that for me. | |
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| re: John Simon on FUN HOME and the "Demented Tonys" | |
| Posted by: | Thom915 10:30 pm EDT 05/06/15 |
| In reply to: | re: John Simon on FUN HOME and the "Demented Tonys" - AlanScott 08:07 pm EDT 05/06/15 |
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| He didn't like the show and it is very obvious he has little use for the graphic novel form and feels the writing of the show does not improve upon it. (I liked the show but admit considering its subject matter and characters, more depth could have been added though it would have made the material less true to its source.) He liked the main performances particularly that of Michael Cerveris. He felt the other principals were not given enough to do. He found the scenery, costumes and lighting were good but added little to the show. He did not like the work of Alison Bechtel, Lisa Kron and particularly Jeanine Tesori but did not descend into personal attacks on them, something he has been known to do to performers and creative artists in the past. I disagree with him about nearly everything particularly his disdain for Changing My Major, my favorite song from the show. I also disagree with nothinglikeashow80's review of Finding Neverland and despite valid points and points of view in both found the latter to be a good deal more vitriolic and condescending. That however is only my opinion. | |
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| re: John Simon on FUN HOME and the "Demented Tonys" | |
| Posted by: | AlanScott 11:41 pm EDT 05/06/15 |
| In reply to: | re: John Simon on FUN HOME and the "Demented Tonys" - Thom915 10:30 pm EDT 05/06/15 |
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| You kind of make me want to read it, even though it does sound like I would disagree with almost everything. | |
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| re: John Simon on FUN HOME and the "Demented Tonys" | |
| Posted by: | garyd 09:40 pm EDT 05/06/15 |
| In reply to: | re: John Simon on FUN HOME and the "Demented Tonys" - AlanScott 08:07 pm EDT 05/06/15 |
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| I read it. Bored on the airplane is my feeble excuse. No need to read it. It is a "nothing here to look at folks, move along" piece of writing. If he has some valid criticisms, they are nothing you have not realized without his venomous guidance. | |
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