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| Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! | |
| Posted by: portenopete 01:18 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| I was just reading an article on the Eltinge 42nd Street Theatre, which is now the multiscreen AMC Empire. According to this piece, there were originally seating options for Slender, Medium and Stout body types, which the article claims was unique. Has anyone ever heard of this idea? In principle it exists because as we all know, many (if not most) theatres have wildly different seats scattered throughout the auditorium, but they are rarely identified on seating charts in the computer system. I imagine house managers and ushers know which are the larger ones and which aren't, so why are they not marked as such in the system and priced accordingly. As a big person, I wouldn't object to paying 20-30% more for a seat I knew would be comfortable. In general house managers on Broadway are very generous in accommodating patrons of girth or shortness and I have been given some beautiful upgrades due to their kindness. But I hate being a whiner when they are trying to get 100 people into their theatre in 20 minutes. For instance, the side seats at the Golden- which look like aisle seats on the seating chart if you don't do your research- can be murderous if you pick the wrong row. The left arm rest in the row I was in was literally embedded into the wall of the theatre, so the smallest person would have their entire left side smooshed, and unless nobody was sitting to your right, you'd have nowhere to lean to minimize the discomfort. A very lovely usher and house manager moved me upstairs to the slip where there there were two chairs (this was house left; house right slip was where the sound booth is) and I had a grand and comfortable view that I'd have happily paid a premium for if it had been offered (within reason). |
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| re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! | |
| Posted by: gobohobo 07:57 am EDT 06/19/18 | |
| In reply to: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! - portenopete 01:18 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| I am fascinated by the Eltinge Theater (and Eltinge himself). What and where was the article you reference? I'd love to read it. | |
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| re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! | |
| Last Edit: singleticket 03:36 pm EDT 06/19/18 | |
| Posted by: singleticket 03:35 pm EDT 06/19/18 | |
| In reply to: re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! - gobohobo 07:57 am EDT 06/19/18 | |
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| So would I. I deeply regret not having taken a picture of a sign that was on the theater that is now removed. I could have been hallucinating but I believe It advertised an Eltinge themed boutique that was either in the lobby of the theater or on the street. I think it was called "Pandora's Box" which is a contextual double-entrendre to make the mind reel. | |
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| re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! | |
| Posted by: pecansforall 09:14 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! - portenopete 01:18 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| I've worked with restoration of several theater houses and I've learned that each seat within any given row can have subtle width differences. The variance can be 1, 2, or 3 inches per seat in a given row. This is how the aisles line up so nicely. An architect with the seating company will receive blueprints of the theater and indicated on the drawings will be where the aisles will fall. On paper the seating company will go in and draw row by row and determine just how many seats per row and what width size each seat should be so that they line up at the aisle nice and evenly. This is also done in order to carefully stagger seats going back. The seating company usually has the width of the seat discreetly marked on the bottom of each seat, usually indicated by an "A", "B", or "C". When the seating rep finishes their paperwork the result would be indication that, for example, row A needs 9 "A" seats, 3 "B" seats, and 2 "C" seats. The next row might be 7 "A" seats, 4 "B" seats, and 3 "C" seats. It is barely visible to the eye but if you were to go to an empty row and move from seat to seat to seat you will quickly notice the width differences. | |
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| Thank you for that incredibly detailed reply! | |
| Posted by: portenopete 10:23 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! - pecansforall 09:14 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| Thanks for backing up with facts what I perceived with casual experimentation when I'm alone in a theatre and have the opportunity to test out seats. The difference of even 1 inch to a theatre seat is noticeable and 3 inches makes one feel very comfortable. Why couldn't the box office couldn't identify those wide seats and price them accordingly? Of course average-sized people would probably snap them up as well for a greater degree of comfort, but at least there might be some improvement for folks like myself and keep us from having to fall on the mercy of the house manager. |
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| re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! | |
| Posted by: AlanScott 09:48 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! - pecansforall 09:14 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| And I think that some time in the last two or three years, an article in the Times mentioned that seats within the same theatre were often different widths. I don't feel like searching for it. I wish I'd just saved it at the time. | |
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| A nightmare in the making | |
| Posted by: MockingbirdGirl 02:54 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! - portenopete 01:18 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| As soon as someone thinks the "stout" seats aren't situated as advantageously in the auditorium as the "medium" seats, or the "medium" seats as advantageously as the "slender" seats, it becomes a public relations nightmare. I can't imagine any theatre management company would voluntarily let themselves in for that. | |
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| re: A nightmare in the making | |
| Posted by: JereNYC (JereNYC@aol.com) 03:21 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: A nightmare in the making - MockingbirdGirl 02:54 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| Can you imagine? I always advise bigger people to look for seats in boxes, which are often free standing and able to be moved around a bit, within reason, to make the sitter more comfortable. |
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| re: A nightmare in the making | |
| Posted by: singleticket 04:54 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: re: A nightmare in the making - JereNYC 03:21 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| Box seats can be the worse option depending on the theater because the sight lines are usually only optimal in the front row and there's often two other rows of two to three seats crammed into the box after that. I believe boxes were originally leant to private parties and families, seasonally or for the single performance. You usually knew the people you were sharing a box with so jostling for space was a family affair, now it means being extra sensitive about the space you're sharing with the people behind or in front of you. I don't like boxes even if I'm lucky enough to get a front row. | |
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| re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! | |
| Posted by: allineedisthegirl 02:33 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! - portenopete 01:18 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| We don't all know that theatres have wildly different seats scattered throughout the auditorium. Well I guess I do now. I've been every broadway theatre and most off-Broadway ones, and the seats, at least per section, always appeared uniform to me. The only notable variances I've notices have been in leg room, which can be insufficient, even for us little people. If there are, indeed, super-sized seats "scattered" throughout the theatres (really?!?!?) I doubt that there are enough to accommodate a meaningful percentage of the large people in the audience. I totally agree about the willingness of house staff to be helpful. db |
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| re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! | |
| Posted by: MistressAndy 03:29 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! - allineedisthegirl 02:33 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| I've done some work in regional theatres and sometimes the difference is really noticeable. There are certain rows where the arm rests fit quite tightly against my sides and others where I have PLENTY of room. I always note which rows have roomier seats and try to purchase accordingly when I attend. | |
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| re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! | |
| Posted by: gothamplaygoer 03:23 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! - allineedisthegirl 02:33 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| I had an awkward experience at New World Stages last week. As I approached my seat, I saw a grossly obese man standing in front of the adjacent seat. I reluctantly took my seat, but when he sat down, so much of him bulged into my space that I could not sit straight. After realizing that two hours of this would be torture, I got up and found the house manager who was very accommodating about finding me another seat. While I certainly would not want to prevent obese people from attending the theater, I wish there were a way to provide them an appropriate seat without embarrassing them and without being unfair to the person in the next seat. | |
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| "Grossly"? | |
| Posted by: portenopete 05:35 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! - gothamplaygoer 03:23 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| Might I ask that you refrain from using the word "grossly" as a modifier for "obese"? Do you have any idea how hurtful that is? Can you imagine the reaction if someone was described as "frighteningly black" or "creepily Jewish"? Your use of "grossly" leads me to wonder whether there's more than just the pilfered space that's problematic: sometimes I think people just don't want to be near fat people as a matter of aesthetic principle. |
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| There are accepted degrees of obesity | |
| Posted by: broadwaybacker 11:38 am EDT 06/19/18 | |
| In reply to: "Grossly"? - portenopete 05:35 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| I can’t believe I’m posting this on this board, but the World Health Organization does have subgroups of obesity, based on body mass index. They are: severe, morbid and super, which correspond to Class I, Class II and Class III obesity. I wonder what the reaction would have been if the OP had used the term “super obese”. By the way, the WHO characterizes super obesity, or Class III obesity as someone whose BMI is greater than 50. But of course, you can’t look at someone and know what their BMI is. So, I don’t have a strong objection to the adjective of “grossly” to modify obese, as it seems to be a reasonably perceived “unscientific” description. |
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| re: There are accepted degrees of obesity | |
| Posted by: broadwaybacker 11:53 am EDT 06/19/18 | |
| In reply to: There are accepted degrees of obesity - broadwaybacker 11:38 am EDT 06/19/18 | |
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| Too late to edit. I meant gothamplaygoer’s description, not the OP. It was the OP who objected to the word “grossly.” | |
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| re: "Grossly"? | |
| Posted by: gothamplaygoer 06:05 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: "Grossly"? - portenopete 05:35 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| Morbidly? | |
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| Better. | |
| Posted by: portenopete 10:26 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: re: "Grossly"? - gothamplaygoer 06:05 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| It's a medical term, but sure. It doesn't present a value judgement like "grossly". And I would suggest that rather than use the word "obese" at all, just stick to "fat". It's not a pejorative word on its own, unless you choose to make it so. I'm glad you say you want to avoid embarrassing the fat person in question, but you do get that calling something "gross" is pretty....gross, right? |
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| re: Better. | |
| Posted by: gothamplaygoer 09:33 am EDT 06/19/18 | |
| In reply to: Better. - portenopete 10:26 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| I apologize for inadvertently offending. | |
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| This should be under portenopete's post | |
| Last Edit: AlanScott 06:24 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| Posted by: AlanScott 06:23 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: re: "Grossly"? - gothamplaygoer 06:05 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| I agree that grossly is a poor choice of modifier, but the problem can be a real one. I've experienced it a few times myself, one time on a trip to London. I had to ask for another seat, which I tried to do as quietly and unobtrusively as possible so as not to embarrass the person in the seat next to me. At first I was told that there were not empty seats, but then one was found for me. I don't know what I would have done if there had not been one. It really would not have been possible for me to sit there leaning over to one side and with my knees over to one side for all those hours. | |
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| re: This should be under portenopete's post | |
| Posted by: portenopete 10:31 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: This should be under portenopete's post - AlanScott 06:23 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| Believe me, when I request a different seat because of space, I am thinking of my neighbour at least as much as I of myself. I am often aching at the end of a show after contorting my frame to keep from impinging on the space of my neighbours. I am always glad when a show is poorly sold so I can move back and have a seat on either side of me. Boxes are a godsend, despite the sometimes less-than-perfect vantage point. And if I am in one and someone is sitting behind me, I always offer to change places since because of my largesse, I tend to sit higher than a thinner person of my height. |
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| re: This should be under portenopete's post | |
| Posted by: AlanScott 02:43 pm EDT 06/19/18 | |
| In reply to: re: This should be under portenopete's post - portenopete 10:31 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| As with people of all sizes, some are considerate neighbors at the theatre, and some are not. I'm sure you're among the considerate ones. | |
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| re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! | |
| Posted by: JereNYC (JereNYC@aol.com) 03:31 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! - gothamplaygoer 03:23 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| There IS a way and it's the way you chose. Now, if the show was a big, sold out hit, then that's going to be a problem, but you handled the situation beautifully. I'm sure that person probably figured out what happened when you didn't return to the seat and was so grateful to not have to suffer the embarrassment for two hours. That person knows, more than anyone else, that he/she is a big person and seats aren't built to accommodate, but, just as there were few options for YOU, there are few options for him/her, other than not attending at all. | |
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| re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! | |
| Posted by: portenopete 10:34 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
| In reply to: re: Slender, Medium and Stout Seating Options: Bring It Back!!! - JereNYC 03:31 pm EDT 06/18/18 | |
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| Or purchasing a second seat, which I have often considered. But at $150/ticket it's kind of beyond my budget. Ironically, it's the cheaper off-Broadway/West End houses that tend to have more comfortable and wider seats, where it isn't so much of an issue. | |
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