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| And Channing was amazing | |
| Posted by: Britannia 03:31 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
| In reply to: TOO OLD For The Role? - RobertC 11:58 am EDT 06/26/18 | |
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| I saw her perform the role in Minneapolis in 1994; I was a senor in high school, and her performance and that show changed my life. She was magnetic, and I haven't seen any other performance come close to that sort of stage presence and magnetism since then except for Sutton Foster in "The Drowsy Chaperone." For me, the question of age depends on the part. I don't know if Dolly's age is specified. I am thinking she could be 40-65, maybe older? On stage, you can fudge age pretty well. If Tom Welling played 18 on "Smallville"at 32, certainly Carol Channing could pull off 60 on stage at 73. I saw Marilu Henner play Annie Oakley, and she sure as heck wasn't 18. Neither was Bernadette Peters, Reba, or any of the celebrities who played the part on Broadway. How old was Sutton Foster when she played Violet? Much too old, and she didn't look the age either; however, it was a show that could withstand the difference. Now, Kristin Chenoweth playing Lilly Garland at 73? No, that wouldn't work. Christine Andreas playing Sarah Brown? Probably not. It's the demands of the role in relation to the story. |
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| re: And Channing was amazing | |
| Posted by: NewsGuy 09:28 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
| In reply to: And Channing was amazing - Britannia 03:31 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
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| Nice. I saw her play during my senior year of high school year, too. Just found the ticket stub from the other day. Amazing memories of that night. | |
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| re: And Channing was amazing | |
| Posted by: BruceinIthaca 07:44 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
| In reply to: And Channing was amazing - Britannia 03:31 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
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| I also think the point in 94 was that it was an opportunity to see a legendary matching of role and performer--of course, she wouldn't be the same as she was in 64. I wasn't either. But it felt like a privilege to be able to see her. And her monologue about the leaf still moved me to tears. 20 years down the road--when I am getting closer to Channing's age then (I still have another decade or so to go), I feel Dolly's loneliness and resolution. I bet Channing would make a fascinating Madame Armfeldt. I saw Margaret Hamilton, Zoe Caldwell, and Elaine Stritch do it--each brought different colors and qualities. Isn't that what makes live theatre wonderful? |
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| re: And Channing was amazing | |
| Posted by: AlanScott 08:58 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
| In reply to: re: And Channing was amazing - BruceinIthaca 07:44 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
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| I wrote a post in response but ATC is screwing with my Mac today. Some ad probably is doing it. Lost the post. So here's a second try. Back in my relatively early days on this board, I used to sometimes post that I would have loved to see her as Armfeldt, but even back then I knew it wouldn't happen. By the time she played her final performances as Dolly back in February 1997, it was because she really had to stop. And I think it would have been impossible for her to learn Madame Armfeldt at that point. But there are various roles, including Madame Armfeldt, Lady Bracknell and Miss Prism, that I would have liked to see her attempt. And at one time, as I noted here a few days ago when suggesting that Mrs. Lovett might have been a good role for her had she not given up on other roles at that point (and if the vocal transpositions necessary would not have probably made it impossible), she sometimes tamped down greatly on the eccentricities for which she was known even from early in her career. Reviewers noted this when she played Ruth in Wonderful Town, especially on tour. Not all the New York critics who reviewed her when she took over here thought she totally succeeded (although Kerr did), but it seems that she did get there. Not that she necessarily would have needed to tamp down much on her eccentricities for Bracknell, Prism, Armfeldt or Lovett. It does seem that a passable English accent and a Cockney were in her arsenal at one time as she played both Eliza Doolittle in Pygmalion and Epifania in The Millionairess to good reviews. Dolly and Lorelei Lee were both her fortune and perhaps just a bit her misfortune. |
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| Years ago, I saw a clip of Channing perform "One Hundred Easy Ways." | |
| Posted by: RobertC (robertcollier930@gmail.com) 09:10 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
| In reply to: re: And Channing was amazing - AlanScott 08:58 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
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| For me, it was kinda flat. | |
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| re: Years ago, I saw a clip of Channing perform "One Hundred Easy Ways." | |
| Posted by: AlanScott 10:58 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
| In reply to: Years ago, I saw a clip of Channing perform "One Hundred Easy Ways." - RobertC 09:10 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
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| i saw it some years back. My memory is that she seemed to be doing it as Channing, not as Ruth, and that doing it as herself was part of the setup. She did it on the Sullivan Show several years after she had played Ruth. | |
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| " I don't know if Dolly's age is specified." | |
| Posted by: RobertC (robertcollier930@gmail.com) 03:36 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
| In reply to: And Channing was amazing - Britannia 03:31 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
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| I know the character of Dolly Levi's age is specified in The Matchmaker. I am 90% sure that it is stated she is in her forties. I'm not sure what the script of Dolly! says, if anything. Maybe somebody who has a better memory can help us out. | |
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| Wilder makes a point of NOT stating her age | |
| Posted by: AlanScott 07:32 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
| In reply to: " I don't know if Dolly's age is specified." - RobertC 03:36 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
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| In both The Merchant of Yonkers and The Matchmaker, the first words describing Dolly are "Uncertain age." He wrote the role with Ruth Gordon in mind. It was first played by Jane Cowl when the play was called The Merchant of Yonkers. It's been suggested that Gordon did not create the role because Wilder and Jed Harris were on the outs, and Gordon was still Harris's unmarried partner. By the time Gordon played the role in Edinburgh, she was 57. She was 59 when she got to Broadway in the role. | |
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| RobertC, if you want to think about casting the role based on what Wilder says | |
| Posted by: AlanScott 08:15 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
| In reply to: Wilder makes a point of NOT stating her age - AlanScott 07:32 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
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| One thing in Wilder that's not in the musical is that Dolly was Vandergelder's wife's "oldest friend." This suggests that Dolly is probably close in age to Vandergelder. Wilder does give an age for Vandergelder: 60. Jane Cowl, who created the role in The Merchant of Yonkers, turned 55 two days after the first tryout performance in Boston. She had been 35 when she had a huge success playing Juliet on Broadway. |
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| re: " I don't know if Dolly's age is specified." | |
| Posted by: IThespis 06:14 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
| In reply to: " I don't know if Dolly's age is specified." - RobertC 03:36 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
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| Dolly Levi, born Gallagher, is old enough to have been married and widowed a while. That's it. Carol Channing was 43 when the show first went up. Little thought was given to Dolly"s age or that the show would become iconic and forever be on people's minds. Ethel Merman was 56 when she closed Dolly's first run. Between 1964 and 1970 just about every theater woman who could move played Dolly, no concern for age. More, since. No matter Dolly's age, the creater of stage Dolly, Ruth Gordon, was 59. Having created such an iconic role, Channing at 40 or 80 would be worth seeing doing it again. In a few years any big-time production with a star 40+, one a name-draw, will work | |
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| re: " I don't know if Dolly's age is specified." | |
| Posted by: JereNYC (JereNYC@aol.com) 03:59 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
| In reply to: " I don't know if Dolly's age is specified." - RobertC 03:36 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
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| At the time the story is set, the late 19th Century, Dolly Levi probably would have realistically been in her early 40's (as was Carol Channing when she first played the role). Dolly would likely have married Ephraim in her teens and enjoyed a 20+ year marriage before widowhood and making the decision to seek out a third act to her life. I have no idea how old Jane Cowl or Ruth Gordon were when they played it, but Shirley Booth certainly appeared older than that. I think we've gradually come to accept the idea of actresses in their 60's and 70's playing the role, first because Channing kept returning to it, second because, as a society, we've come to look at aging in a different way (60's and 70's now is much different than 60's and 70's in prior generations, and third because the parade of actresses who followed Channing in the original production and the original tours were largely older. I wonder if an actress in her 40's would even be accepted in the role today. Would she appear way too young to our contemporary eyes? Or would someone in her 40's not have had the time to have the long, iconic career that we've come to expect from actresses playing this role in major productions. If Midler or Peters had played Dolly in the 1980's...would they have had the impact that they've had in the current production? |
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| re: " I don't know if Dolly's age is specified." | |
| Posted by: BruceinIthaca 07:47 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
| In reply to: re: " I don't know if Dolly's age is specified." - JereNYC 03:59 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
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| I also think an actress in her early 40s today might be seen as creating a confusion with Irene Molloy, also a widow. That Irene is a woman who has experienced love and sex and can be a loving guide to both for the innocent Cornelius is poignant and amusing at the same time. | |
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| re: " I don't know if Dolly's age is specified." | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 07:22 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
| In reply to: re: " I don't know if Dolly's age is specified." - JereNYC 03:59 pm EDT 06/26/18 | |
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| Kristin and Sutton are in their 40s and I think they'd both be great as Dolly. | |
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