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| re: Guinevere - Likable | |
| Posted by: Michael_Portantiere 01:53 pm EDT 08/06/20 | |
| In reply to: re: Guinevere - Likable - lordofspeech 12:51 pm EDT 08/06/20 | |
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| Although I do disagree about the show in general and Guenevere's character in particular, you support your opinions very well. By the way, I think one important thing to keep in mind is that, in the original stage version of the the show, at least, I believe we are supposed to think that Guenevere and Lancelot never sexually consummate their relationship, out of respect for Arthur. This was not the case in the movie, where during "If Ever I Would Leave You" we see a montage of scenes that make it clear they have begun a sexual relationship (without actually showing it, of course, as this was a musical film released by a major studio in 1967). And in the pared-down version of the show that has been staged in several places in recent years, and which I saw at the Two River Theater in NJ, there was at the end of Act I a scene of partial nudity that showed us the two characters have become sexually involved. |
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| re: Guinevere - Likable | |
| Last Edit: lordofspeech 07:43 pm EDT 08/06/20 | |
| Posted by: lordofspeech 07:28 pm EDT 08/06/20 | |
| In reply to: re: Guinevere - Likable - Michael_Portantiere 01:53 pm EDT 08/06/20 | |
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| Yes. Yes. I could (and have) gone on and on about what Julie Andrews’ first autobiography says about the creators’ decision to keep the Lancelot-Guenevere relationship chaste. I even said so somewhere below. I think she and they are correct. I think it weakens the storyline and the character if she lacks a moral integrity to match Arthur’s (as in the film and the Two-Rivers revisal). TH White was determined to de-mythologize all of them, but particularly Guenevere. He created her with black hair and a very passionate, selfish temperament. And in The Mists of Avalon, Guenevere is very complexly ignoble. But, in this show, she’s better than that. And the show becomes about the vision of the Round Table, which she too embraces. It’s for all three of them. And look at what is said in I LOVED YOU ONCE IN SILENCE so late in the play. |
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| re: Guinevere - Likable | |
| Posted by: Michael_Portantiere 01:38 pm EDT 08/07/20 | |
| In reply to: re: Guinevere - Likable - lordofspeech 07:28 pm EDT 08/06/20 | |
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| "I think it weakens the storyline and the character if she lacks a moral integrity to match Arthur’s." I completely agree, but one of my problems with the character of Guenevere as written in the musical is that her transition from 1) a terribly immature and selfish young woman who wishes to have people go to war over her and goads three knights to injure or kill Lancelot in the jousts, to 2) a mature woman of moral integrity, is just too sudden. We're supposed to think all of this happens in an instant, when Guenevere sees Lancelot apparently bring Sir Lionel back from the dead after he's killed in the jousts. Now, admittedly, seeing something like that happen would be likely to have a huge effect on all spectators, but it still seems too facile a way to completely transform all aspects of Guenevere's personality all of a sudden. And I just wish the character didn't seem quite so incredibly selfish and, as someone else phrased it, even bloodthirsty as she does in "The Simple Joys of Maidenhood" and "Take Me to the Fair." |
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