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| Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: WaymanWong 08:07 pm EST 02/18/21 | |
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| Are any of the shows sending out swag to refresh the Tony voters' memories? Has the delay helped or hurt anyone's chances? | |
| Link | Forbes.com: Tony Award Nominees May Suffer Due to Delay in Voting |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: seenenuf 08:37 pm EST 02/18/21 | |
| In reply to: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - WaymanWong 08:07 pm EST 02/18/21 | |
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| Please give up this dream. It no longer matters. |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: charles1055 11:39 am EST 02/19/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - seenenuf 08:37 pm EST 02/18/21 | |
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| I agree, it's an awful situation but too much time has passed and the winners this year will always be less legitimate because of the abbreviated season. The only three shows nominated that have a chance of coming back are Tina, Jagged Little Pill and Moulin Rouge, and if the point of the Tonys is to sell tickets, what's the benefit of The Inheritance winning a ton of awards if no one can see it? I also seriously doubt that any of the shuttered shows would gain enough from a Tonys ceremony to justify putting on the Tonys. They should create a class of awards (maybe a citation) for all the nominees and let the shows that survive compete when Broadway returns. |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 04:17 pm EST 02/19/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - charles1055 11:39 am EST 02/19/21 | |
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| I don't think time is an important factor. Because of the nature of theater, Tony voters are always consulting their memory of the performances and responding to whichever performer wowed them in a way that they still remember, even months after the fact. If someone saw 'Tina" when it first opened and thought, "Adrienne Warren, yes, she's my Tony winner", and then nothing else they saw changed their opinion that Adrienne Warren would get their vote, then it doesn't really change things whether they have to wait two months or two years to cast that vote. And as some of us keep saying, awards are always based upon a whole host of random factors that can affect how they are seen as "legitimate" - just see the thread about whether "Nine" would have beat "Cats" and whether it was legitimate to give T.S. Eliot a Tony aware for a book he didn't write. So this season was cut short, there were still a fair amount of shows that opened. Other seasons have had less shows open in more time. That's just the nature of awards that are based on arbitrary calendars. |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: ryhog 03:37 pm EST 02/19/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - charles1055 11:39 am EST 02/19/21 | |
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| less legitimate to whom? If I have one on my mantle when it's all over, I would find the hardware pretty legit. regarding the rest, perhaps you did not read what I wrote below, but the awards are but a pretext, and the bulk of what will be marketed on the show will be forward looking. As to the last, well, that ship has sailed a long time ago. And again, I have a feeling that if you won one, you'd be happy to embrace your pretext. :-) |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 06:58 am EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - ryhog 03:37 pm EST 02/19/21 | |
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| So is it a commercial? Or is it a chance to honor excellence with a trophy that you yourself claim you would want? Would you think "This Tony means I did excellent work"? Or would you think "This Tony means they wanted to sell tickets to the show I was in"? | |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: ryhog 09:55 am EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - KingSpeed 06:58 am EST 02/21/21 | |
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| I think we pretty much agree about this subject based on your other posts. I'll just address this one a little more. The Tonys can be both a commercial and a chance to honor excellence. The commercial aspect deals with the why it is produced, the award aspect is to acknowledge the work that excels. (There is admittedly a collision every so often, when it seems that some voters take commerce into consideration in making their selection. I think this happens mostly in the show level categories, because it is a well-accepted fact that only they have commercial implications.) Also, a lot of the commercial (especially this year) is brand advertising, not show specific. Finally, just an observation: had McCarrell been nominated, he would not have had a snowball's chance in hell of going home with the Tony. So would that have have somehow legitimized the award for those here who seem to think it is currently illegitimate? | |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Last Edit: WaymanWong 04:05 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
| Posted by: WaymanWong 03:55 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - ryhog 09:55 am EST 02/21/21 | |
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| ''Had McCarrell been nominated, he would not have had a snowball's chance in hell of going home with the Tony.'' I agree 100%. There's no way he would've won, and I bet even McCarrell would agree. But to me, McCarrell did stellar work that was WORTHY of a Tony nomination. And even in the negative notices for ''The Lightning Thief,'' he got singled out for praise. Of course, who does and doesn't deserve to be nominated, let alone win, is a subjective call. I've seen lesser performances than McCarrell's that got Tony-nominated (and even a couple that won). I still think it's important to recognize excellent work whether it's in a hit or a flop. And to my way of thinking, McCarrell and his ''Lightning Thief'' castmate Ryan Knowles, whom the N.Y. Times cited among ''the Best of Theater 2019,'' were wrongfully written off by Tony nominators. Finally, it's silly to think a Tveit win would be somehow less legitimate because he's the only Tony nominee in his category. For its first decade, the Tonys simply announced the winners; there were no nominees. (Only in 1956 did they start announcing nominees.) |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: charles1055 09:52 pm EST 02/19/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - ryhog 03:37 pm EST 02/19/21 | |
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| Yes, I'm sure that Aaron Tviet's feat of beating absolutely no one will be very legitimate... | |
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| Are the 1995 Tony Awards illegimate? | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 06:38 pm EST 02/20/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - charles1055 09:52 pm EST 02/19/21 | |
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| "Yes, I'm sure that Aaron Tviet's feat of beating absolutely no one will be very legitimate..." As opposed to Glenn Close beating only one other person for her "Sunset Boulevard" Tony? Or ALW beating no one at all for his? Or how both Best Musical *and* Best Revival that year only had two nominees each? What about the years where Best Score had a full roster of nominees, but not all of them came from musicals? What is the threshold for legitimate? |
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| re: Are the 1995 Tony Awards illegimate? | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 07:15 am EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: Are the 1995 Tony Awards illegimate? - Singapore/Fling 06:38 pm EST 02/20/21 | |
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| If we think of the award as an honor for excellence in the theater, then of course those awards are very legitimate whether there 10 nominees or only 1. It's still an acknowledgement. If we think of the awards as a sporting event, then yes the 1995 Tonys have a BIG asterisk by them because who cares who wins a game if there's only one contestant? | |
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| re: Are the 1995 Tony Awards illegimate? | |
| Posted by: ryhog 09:36 pm EST 02/20/21 | |
| In reply to: Are the 1995 Tony Awards illegimate? - Singapore/Fling 06:38 pm EST 02/20/21 | |
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| If the awardee's parents were married at the time of said awardee's birth. | |
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| re: Are the 1995 Tony Awards illegimate? | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 12:42 am EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Are the 1995 Tony Awards illegimate? - ryhog 09:36 pm EST 02/20/21 | |
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| But we're progressives, right, we don't get hung up on such things, love is love. :-) |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: ryhog 10:13 pm EST 02/19/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - charles1055 09:52 pm EST 02/19/21 | |
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| Sigh. We don't "beat" people. We are awarded. This is not a sporting event. And yes Aaron will proudly place his Tony on his mantel and cherish it. |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 07:01 am EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - ryhog 10:13 pm EST 02/19/21 | |
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| Exactly. This should be an AWARD show. Something that means something. NOT a commercial to get butts in the seats. Those are two different things. And you don't know how proudly he'll place the award on his mantel and how much he'll cherish it. That's up to him. | |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Last Edit: WaymanWong 03:35 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
| Posted by: WaymanWong 03:29 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - KingSpeed 07:01 am EST 02/21/21 | |
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| ''And you don't know how proudly he'll place the award on his mantel and how much he'll cherish it.'' After the Tony nominations were announced in October, this was Aaron's reaction: ''It's a huge honor and I am so grateful to be nominated!! It's also vitally important to highlight that this recognition represents, collectively, thousands of hours of work by hundreds of individuals working on 'Moulin Rouge! The Musical.' ...'' And as recently as last month, here's what Aaron said about the Tony nominations to the New York Times: ''I was so happy they decided to go forward with it — it was a strange year and a shortened season, but there was a lot of great work done. I’ve tried to think of my nomination as recognition of my work and the performance. And I did reach out to [“The Lightning Thief” actor] Chris McCarrell, who was the other person who could have been nominated — I’ve had a couple of difficult Tony mornings, so I understand what that feels like.'' Based on what Aaron's said, I'd say the Tonys and what they represent matter to him, and he WOULD be very proud to put a Tony on his mantel. |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 01:42 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - KingSpeed 07:01 am EST 02/21/21 | |
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| They really aren't two different things, though. All manner of industries give out awards both to honor excellence AND to create outside interest in the product the industry is selling. The Oscars are a wonderful way of acknowledging incredible work AND a way to get people to go to the movies or subscribe to a streaming platform in order to watch all of the nominees before they join the office pool and then watch the television broadcast, which the industry is very open about regarding as a giant commercial for movies as a whole. Many of us like to believe that awards exist entirely for their own beneficence, but that's naive. |
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| I agree with you | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 06:57 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - Singapore/Fling 01:42 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
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| I was disagreeing with ryhog who said the ONLY reason for the Tonys was marketing. | |
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| re: I agree with you | |
| Posted by: ryhog 09:13 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: I agree with you - KingSpeed 06:57 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
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| "I was disagreeing with ryhog who said the ONLY reason for the Tonys was marketing." I never said that and I never would. What I said is that, were it not for the marketing opportunity, the Tonys (as we know them over the last half century) would not exist. |
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| re: I agree with you | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 12:25 am EST 02/22/21 | |
| In reply to: re: I agree with you - ryhog 09:13 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
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| That’s not what you said. | |
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| re: I agree with you | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 08:10 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: I agree with you - KingSpeed 06:57 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
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| That's not the message that I've been getting from what ryhog has been sharing. I don't think he's saying that marketing is the only reason the Tonys are happening, but that marketing is a primary driver of WHEN they are happening.. and perhaps that viewpoint exposes the ugly truth that for the Broadway League, marketing truly is everything. But it is too late in the day for us to be surprised that money and commerce matters on Broadway, as opposed to art and artists. | |
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| Here are ryhog’s exact words: | |
| Last Edit: KingSpeed 12:27 am EST 02/22/21 | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 12:25 am EST 02/22/21 | |
| In reply to: re: I agree with you - Singapore/Fling 08:10 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
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“But, let's try to remember: :-) 1. The modern Tonys exist for one and only one reason: marketing. “ There you have it. |
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| which you refuse to read correctly per my explanation | |
| Posted by: ryhog 09:08 am EST 02/22/21 | |
| In reply to: Here are ryhog’s exact words: - KingSpeed 12:25 am EST 02/22/21 | |
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| This is getting silly. Why do you refuse to process what I have written? The modern Tonys [meaning those produced on a national TV broadcast, with lots of production, as opposed to the earlier ones that were essentially private affairs] exist only for one reason, because there is a big payoff in marketing. The League and its members would not spend the millions of dollars otherwise. But that has to do with causation, not some other reading of my words that you seem obsessed with. I have made my meaning clear. |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: ryhog 02:10 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - Singapore/Fling 01:42 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
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| There are, I think, awards that have no commercial angle. As an example, I think one would be hard pressed to find a commercial connection in the awarding of the Pulitzer Prize for Drama. But the Tonys would not have been on CBS for the last x years without the League and its members footing the bill. And in the absence of that, the Tony awards would not have the stature that they do. (There would be no EGOTs, just EGOs. :-) ) Compare, for example, the Bessie Awards. | |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 02:21 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - ryhog 02:10 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
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| I broadly agree, in that we have awards that lie outside of these industries or aren't awarded by the commercial heads of those industries. Though the Pulitzer Prize for Drama is an offshoot of an industry award that does exists to push the work of journalists and newspapers... and that seems all the more important in this day and age. | |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: ryhog 02:59 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - Singapore/Fling 02:21 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
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| I would distinguish it because the award does not even indirectly push the work of journalism, and of course journalism does not have any economic interest in which work gets the award. But we disgress :-) | |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 01:28 am EST 02/20/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - ryhog 10:13 pm EST 02/19/21 | |
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| We don't "beat" people. We are awarded. This is not a sporting event. In your mind, perhaps. But I think to many people, the competition is the whole point. It IS a sporting event. |
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| Yikes! | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 07:09 am EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - Chromolume 01:28 am EST 02/20/21 | |
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| Who thinks of this as a sporting event??? Art is not a competition. Actors are awarded trophies for their performances but the actors giving their performances (if they're doing it right) are telling a story. Not trying to score more points than the actress two blocks away. If I won a Tony, I wouldn't think of it as beating the other nominees at all. If anything, the real competition in this business is the auditioning process in which one actor literally tries to overcome all the other candidates to secure the role. Even then, the ultimate decision by the director is an artistic one and not whoever scores 100 points wins. As an actor, when someone else gets a role I auditioned for, I'm happy for them and understand that many of us can play these roles and that this is just their turn. But back to the Tonys. I love sporting events. That is why I watch the NBA Playoffs. For the Tonys, I tune in to watch a celebration of theater. At least, that's what I hope for. |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: ryhog 01:47 pm EST 02/20/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - Chromolume 01:28 am EST 02/20/21 | |
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| My mind is the only thing I am responsible for. :-) In a sporting event, one performs a feat that either wins or loses (or, depending on the sport, ties). People who make theatre (a) do it to create something that's hopefully worthwhile, often without having the vaguest idea of who might later be up for an award at the same time, and (b) don't do it to win an award. While Aaron Tveit was losing sleep over the notes he got one afternoon from Alex Timbers, it was not because he was worried about beating Chris McCarrell (or anyone else) at the Tonys. I don't think you really believe that "the competition is the whole point." |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 01:56 pm EST 02/20/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - ryhog 01:47 pm EST 02/20/21 | |
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| I don't think you really believe that "the competition is the whole point." Not for the nominees, of course. But for the audience, yes. If not, many of us out here wouldn't spend days and hours beforehand arguing over who should win, who will win, etc. For us, it's a competition, and in places like this, it gets pretty fanatical. Perhaps the comparison should be a little more to "fantasy" sports games, etc? |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 07:12 am EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - Chromolume 01:56 pm EST 02/20/21 | |
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| But if you want that rush, watch real sports in which the outcome truly hangs in the balance on live TV. As I said, you can't do much better than the NBA Playoffs in terms of real live drama. The Tony Award winners are already determined before the show begins. We're just witnessing the announcement. That is not a sport. | |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 02:25 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - KingSpeed 07:12 am EST 02/21/21 | |
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| I mean, that's a weird analogy, because the entire season is the playoff game - we're watching each show and each performance, and then debating and analyzing who should win, and then going through all of the other awards to build up the excitement, and then finally at the Tony Awards we're in like the last minute of the game, and either the score is super close or we know it's pretty much a blowout, but either way it's not decided until the buzzer blow and the envelope is opened. I'm not a big fan of the way Chromolume is framing the awards show as being about the competition first and foremost, but I can't say I don't also get caught up in the competitive spirit of it all. And that aspect of it is cultivated by the awarding bodies, in order to get us more invested in it, and therefore watching all the content, and therefore supporting the industry. |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Last Edit: WaymanWong 01:28 am EST 02/20/21 | |
| Posted by: WaymanWong 01:21 am EST 02/20/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - ryhog 10:13 pm EST 02/19/21 | |
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| ''And yes Aaron will proudly place his Tony on his mantel and cherish it.'' And well he should. For the record, Aaron still needs to get 60% of the Tony vote to win, but I'm sure he will make it (and deserve to). You can't take a Tony nomination for granted. Just ask Chris McCarrell of ''The Lightning Thief'' (who wasn't nominated but should've been). Instead of stewing over a ''snub,'' McCarrell urged his fans on Twitter to support and celebrate the other Broadway shows whenever they return. And Aaron, who's known how it feels to get passed over by the Tonys in the past, reached out to McCarrell in consolation. To me, Aaron and Chris are class acts. |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 08:36 pm EST 02/18/21 | |
| In reply to: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - WaymanWong 08:07 pm EST 02/18/21 | |
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| has anyone seriously considered that trying to do these retroactive Tony awards makes no sense at all? I'm not saying that the actors, directors and designers don't deserve some sort of recognition for their work pre-covid. But at this point, what's the point, if it can't be done reliably? Will the awards really be greeted with enthusiasm, or will it just fizzle because the whole thing feels rather empty this time? Will anyone care except diehard theatre fans such as us, and of course those of us in the industry? If all we have to go on is the possibly faded memories of the voters (and that's a valid argument to make), what is the point? |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: ryhog 09:28 pm EST 02/18/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - Chromolume 08:36 pm EST 02/18/21 | |
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| to answer your question: yes, there are those who have think it makes no sense at all. (And there are those here and elsewhere who take this position in every year.) But, let's try to remember: :-) 1. The modern Tonys exist for one and only one reason: marketing. 2. The awards will be a smaller slice of the show than usual, if for no other reason because there is less ground to cover. 3. There will be an open door policy on performances, meaning anyone who wants to pay can play. 4. The usual suspects will watch the show. 5. The first season back is going to be VERY local, so that is motivation enough to market the hell out of whatever we have happening. 6. It's not going to be normal because nothing is going to be normal. Now on the subject of recollection, the article is silly, and not a very good measure of much of anything. Tony voters saw the shows they saw as Tony voters, not as random theatre-goers out for a night on the town. Unless they are the type that never did, they paid attention and they remember what they saw at least enough to distinguish between the limited selection that will be placed before them. I have not forgotten the details of the last 10 shows I saw, because I watch theatre differently than the average person and I know from reading this board that so do a lot of people here. including you. Plus I doubt seriously that there is data suggesting a material difference in recollection by professionals between 6 months and 16 months or whatever it ends up being. But getting back to #1 above, it doesn't matter. Votes will be tallied. People will be recognized. And we will move on. The message is simple: the fabulous invalid can still crawl. |
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| If the Tonys exist for that one and only one reason.... | |
| Last Edit: KingSpeed 06:50 am EST 02/21/21 | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 06:49 am EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - ryhog 09:28 pm EST 02/18/21 | |
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| ...then why do we have them at all? A Tony is an award, not a commercial. The number one reason should be to honor excellence in the theater just as the Oscars are to honor excellence in film. The Oscars aren't a series of commercials for Marvel Universe and Star Wars movies. If the Tonys is just a show of overly sold jukebox numbers (like the recent NBC special), what's the point? You can market Broadway all you want on TV, but if its not about honoring excellence in the theater, then don't call it the Tonys. At this point, the Tonys should be given out ASAP in a press conference format. Then, whenever Broadway comes back, you can have a big Welcome Back Broadway special and the Off-Broadway cast of Jersey Boys can sing all night. | |
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| re: If the Tonys exist for that one and only one reason.... | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 02:29 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: If the Tonys exist for that one and only one reason.... - KingSpeed 06:49 am EST 02/21/21 | |
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| You seem to have forgotten that the Oscars expanded the Best Picture slot to 10, in order to make room for crowd-friendly blockbusters, and then even tried to create a Blockbuster category for just this very reason (and also because they want to drive viewers for the live TV show). And then the live TV show is full of clips of movies that include flashy spectacle from the latest Marvel and Star Wars franchise entries (which are all nominated in the craft categories like VFX and sound); and in the rare case of a film like "Black Panther", are actually giving it awards and further featuring it on TV. It's a commercial that honors excellence. And can be an excellent commercial. |
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| re: If the Tonys exist for that one and only one reason.... | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 07:02 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: If the Tonys exist for that one and only one reason.... - Singapore/Fling 02:29 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
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| My quibble was with ryhog who said the only reason for the Tonys is for marketing. That is not true for the Oscars. | |
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| re: If the Tonys exist for that one and only one reason.... | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 08:10 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: re: If the Tonys exist for that one and only one reason.... - KingSpeed 07:02 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
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| Why do you think the Oscars are different from the Tonys? Or am I misreading your post? | |
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| re: If the Tonys exist for that one and only one reason.... | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 12:30 am EST 02/22/21 | |
| In reply to: re: If the Tonys exist for that one and only one reason.... - Singapore/Fling 08:10 pm EST 02/21/21 | |
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| The Oscars are different than what he says the Tonys are. | |
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| re: If the Tonys exist for that one and only one reason.... | |
| Posted by: ryhog 11:12 am EST 02/21/21 | |
| In reply to: If the Tonys exist for that one and only one reason.... - KingSpeed 06:49 am EST 02/21/21 | |
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| I missed this one earlier when I said I thought we agreed on your other posts LOL I think you misunderstand a little. What I have said is that the marketing aspect is what makes the Tonys possible. Producers pay big money because it is a cost-effective marketing tool, not because it is to honor excellence (although honoring excellence is a significant part of the marketing). Having a commercial motive does not mean that the Tonys don't honor excellence; they do. But what I think it is essential to understand is that the League owns the Tonys and that is because it is deemed a great marketing tool. Without that marketing, the Drama Desks et al would suffice to award excellence. Hence, the idea of just having a press conference misapprehends the raison d'être of the Tonys. And having a special (even indulging in the notion that CBS would sign on) is not the same thing. The Tonys are a brand too. |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: Quicheo 10:27 am EST 02/19/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - ryhog 09:28 pm EST 02/18/21 | |
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| I agree with your excellent analysis except for point 5. I think there are a lot of people with extra travel money burning a hole in their proverbial pockets. If hotels and airlines continue to have lower rates than typical, this will fuel the desire to return to "before time" travel behavior, including New York and New York theater. Some may stay away, yes, but fear of Covid is more diffuse in the hinterlands and if Broadway is even remotely called safe, barricades will be stormed. Heck, if Ted Cruz's daughters can get him to travel to Mexico in a snowstorm, imagine what the Six-loving, slime crowd can get their parents to do. |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: ryhog 12:56 pm EST 02/19/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - Quicheo 10:27 am EST 02/19/21 | |
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| I can't argue with that because no one can actually know the contours. There is no question that there are people with money in their pockets, but there are also many with none. I agree that folks who have worked through the pandemic, have been armed (no pun intended) with an effective vaccine, and are theatre lovers may come but I guess the question is the depth of that audience for a year or so. My sense is that the expectation is that there will be a heavy dependence on relatively local audiences. The added consideration is that the shows that will sell early on (to locals) may not be the ones people will travel in to see. Could I and others be dead wrong? Yep. | |
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| re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? | |
| Posted by: NewtonUK 08:29 am EST 02/19/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Try to remember: Will Tony ballots test the voters' powers of recollection? - ryhog 09:28 pm EST 02/18/21 | |
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| I agree 100%. And speaking for myself, when the nominations came out in October i printed them out, thought about it, and circled the nominees I was going to vote for. I'm sure many voters did the same. | |
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