Threaded Order Chronological Order
| L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards | |
| Posted by: WaymanWong 11:40 pm EDT 04/05/21 | |
|
|
|
| How important is the L.A. Stage Alliance? And could there have been another way to resolve this, other than shutting down? | |
| Link | Deadline.com: L.A. Stage Alliance Ceases Operations After Membership Revolt Following Misidentification of Asian Ovation Award Nominee |
| reply to this message | |
| Can anyone explain why you tried to make this all about a mispronounced name? | |
| Posted by: whereismikeyfl 10:12 pm EDT 04/07/21 | |
| In reply to: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards - WaymanWong 11:40 pm EDT 04/05/21 | |
|
|
|
| One of the most depressing things about reading this thread was seeing people trying to sell the idea that this was all about one mispronounced name. Is anyone brave enough to explain why they did it? Or are doing it? |
|
| Link | No, LA Stage Alliance Didn’t Fold Over a Single Anti-Asian Blunder |
| reply to this message | |
| re: Can anyone explain why you tried to make this all about a mispronounced name? | |
| Last Edit: singleticket 12:03 pm EDT 04/08/21 | |
| Posted by: singleticket 11:53 am EDT 04/08/21 | |
| In reply to: Can anyone explain why you tried to make this all about a mispronounced name? - whereismikeyfl 10:12 pm EDT 04/07/21 | |
|
|
|
| Because the original piece framed it that way. Once the ball is rolling it's nearly impossible to stop. That's why people like the Penske family and Mohammed Bin Salman spend hundreds of millions on media companies like Deadline. It allows them to hold tremendous power and if we have emotions we are subject to it. I linked an article below that was a mix of truth and conflated lies because of the emotional content of this thread that was generated by the Deadline article. If we think we are immune to the manipulative power of media than we are wrong. Thanks for linking Howard Ho's piece, it's very good. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Can anyone explain why you tried to make this all about a mispronounced name? | |
| Last Edit: whereismikeyfl 03:51 pm EDT 04/08/21 | |
| Posted by: whereismikeyfl 03:49 pm EDT 04/08/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Can anyone explain why you tried to make this all about a mispronounced name? - singleticket 11:53 am EDT 04/08/21 | |
|
|
|
| I have to differ. The article did not get specific, but clearly said at a few points that the mispronunciation was seen as just the last in a series of mistakes. Also, the article had a link to an earlier Deadline piece that gave a little more background. So it is not as if people did not know that there was more behind this. (And would anyone really think that 40 companies would pull out because of one incident? ) |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| Sounds Fair. Weren't the Oscars Cancelled When John Travolta mispronounced Idina Menzel's Name? | |
| Posted by: Jax 01:30 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards - WaymanWong 11:40 pm EDT 04/05/21 | |
|
|
|
| This is absurd. Hope that actress Jully (rhymes with bully?) Lee is satisfied. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Sounds Fair. Weren't the Oscars Cancelled When John Travolta mispronounced Idina Menzel's Name? | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 08:14 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: Sounds Fair. Weren't the Oscars Cancelled When John Travolta mispronounced Idina Menzel's Name? - Jax 01:30 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| Um, Travolta didn't "mispronounce" Idina Menzel's name. He made up an entirely new one. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Sounds Fair. Weren't the Oscars Cancelled When John Travolta mispronounced Idina Menzel's Name? | |
| Posted by: Quicheo 11:03 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Sounds Fair. Weren't the Oscars Cancelled When John Travolta mispronounced Idina Menzel's Name? - Chromolume 08:14 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| Travolta has a reading disorder. Seriously. Part of the reason he sought out his chosen religion. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Sounds Fair. Weren't the Oscars Cancelled When John Travolta mispronounced Idina Menzel's Name? | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 11:53 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Sounds Fair. Weren't the Oscars Cancelled When John Travolta mispronounced Idina Menzel's Name? - Quicheo 11:03 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| A good point in terms of people making fun of Travolta, but also - if Travolta has trouble reading a teleprompter, he should really learn his lines before going on national TV to introduce a singer. Or wear an earpiece. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Sounds Fair. Weren't the Oscars Cancelled When John Travolta mispronounced Idina Menzel's Name? | |
| Posted by: Quicheo 03:46 pm EDT 04/07/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Sounds Fair. Weren't the Oscars Cancelled When John Travolta mispronounced Idina Menzel's Name? - Singapore/Fling 11:53 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| Like a lot of people with Dyslexia, he thought he had it down (he apparently memorizes everything he says at events like this--and consequently doesn't do them often). But when memory failed, he went to the prompter and read what he saw. I agree about the earpiece, and I suspect he will never appear without one again. But as Dyslexia is a hot-button topic in his religion, I wonder if he will ever address this in a conventional way. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| Not What Happened | |
| Last Edit: Singapore/Fling 01:58 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 01:52 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: Sounds Fair. Weren't the Oscars Cancelled When John Travolta mispronounced Idina Menzel's Name? - Jax 01:30 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| Your response is absurd. Nothing in the reporting indicates that Jully (rhymes with Julie) Lee was personally seeking to harm the organization over this gaffe - and actually, the coverage in the Times indicates the exact opposite. Moreover, the good reporting on this event points to years of the Alliance's dysfunction in working with non-white theaters, and this even was simply the tipping point. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards | |
| Posted by: joerialto 12:57 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards - WaymanWong 11:40 pm EDT 04/05/21 | |
|
|
|
| One strike and you’re out! | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards | |
| Posted by: ryhog 02:01 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: re: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards - joerialto 12:57 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| Except it is not the first strike, something you would know if you had even so much as skimmed the readily available content. What are we to make of your post? Are you suggesting that there is not systemic racism in our industry? |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| This Was Their Umpeenth Strike | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 01:55 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: re: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards - joerialto 12:57 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| Again, look at some of the reporting on this history of the Alliance and you'll see that this isn't about a singular incident. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards | |
| Posted by: NewtonUK 11:20 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards - WaymanWong 11:40 pm EDT 04/05/21 | |
|
|
|
| Has anyone watched the Tony nominations the last 4 or 5 years? The folk announcing nominations can rarely pronounce anyone's names. I guess, on top of everything else, one is no longer allowed to make mistakes. There are few things more unwarranted, sadly, than Cancel Culture. No explanations allowed. No investigations. You made a mistake. You're dead to me. Not a good way to look at the world. Cancel Culture is the QAnon of the left. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards | |
| Posted by: StageDoorJohnny 09:57 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: re: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards - NewtonUK 11:20 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| you obviously know little of the history of the Stage Alliance -- this was the straw hat broke the camel's back. It's hardly cancel culture, it's the pigeons coming home to roost | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| This Isn't About Mispronouncing a Name | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 01:54 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: re: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards - NewtonUK 11:20 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| Do your research, get your facts, don't believe every headline you read on the internet. Good advice for QAnon folks and for you as well. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: This Isn't About Mispronouncing a Name | |
| Posted by: ryhog 02:05 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: This Isn't About Mispronouncing a Name - Singapore/Fling 01:54 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| Part of that research might also be well spent discovering that "cancel culture" is a trope of the racist right. At its root is a denial of systemic racism. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards | |
| Last Edit: singleticket 11:39 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
| Posted by: singleticket 11:39 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: re: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards - NewtonUK 11:20 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| Cancel Culture is the QAnon of the left. No, it's not. I have plenty of problems with the social media court of justice but the above is a both a false opposition and a false equivalency. Things are polarized, that is true. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| Deadline article | |
| Last Edit: singleticket 09:50 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
| Posted by: singleticket 09:49 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards - WaymanWong 11:40 pm EDT 04/05/21 | |
|
|
|
| The Deadline article presented the story from the perspective of the LA Theater Alliance and did not include the context that the group has been struggling financially even before the pandemic. It's almost tailored to go directly into the right-wing culture war media machine like a bullet. A bit below about Deadline's owner Jay Penske who also owns Variety, Hollywood Reporter and Rolling Stone. |
|
| Link | The Demise of Rolling Stone: How A Legendary Magazine Sold Out to Trump and the Saudis |
| reply to this message | reply to first message | |
| re: Deadline article | |
| Last Edit: singleticket 10:06 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
| Posted by: singleticket 10:04 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: Deadline article - singleticket 09:49 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| The article that I linked weakens its case by conflating the award given to Penske's father by Trump with the son himself. If I read it more closely I would not have linked. Still, I'm very wary of Deadline, etc. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| The state of theatre in Los Angeles... | |
| Posted by: Maguire75 09:31 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards - WaymanWong 11:40 pm EDT 04/05/21 | |
|
|
|
| I think the shuttering of the LA Stage Alliance is also a reflection of the current state of theatre in Los Angeles. The LA Stage Alliance is chiefly known for presenting the 'Ovation Awards" - which is Los Angeles's version of the Tonys. As with any awards group, they've seen their fair share of drama over the years, with a number of major arts organizations withdrawing from the Alliance - either due to awards politics, or things like the semantics of making seats available to Ovation voters, which can be costly. Los Angeles has also seen turmoil over AEA's rulings putting new restrictions on Equity waiver theatre (which in LA was mostly referred to as the "99 seat plan") which for better or for worse shuttered a number of smaller theatres who couldn't (or wouldn't) comply. Add to that the closing of many of the major Equity houses over the past couple of decades (Long Beach Civic Light Opera, Fullerton Civic Light Opera, Redondo Beach Civic Light Opera, etc.) and now, of course, the pandemic putting the lid on all live performance, you can see how the Alliance is / has been facing diminishing returns for a long time Los Angeles, for all of its talent and its cultured population, has just never been a major theatre town. It does have one of the country's leading theatrical advocates in Charles McNulty, drama critic for the Los Angeles Times. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: The state of theatre in Los Angeles... | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 01:56 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: The state of theatre in Los Angeles... - Maguire75 09:31 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| Thanks for the run-down, that is all very helpful to know. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| What WAS the L.A. Stage Alliance? | |
| Posted by: reed23 12:05 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards - WaymanWong 11:40 pm EDT 04/05/21 | |
|
|
|
| I've been looking for even the most basic information about this LA Stage Alliance since the story began. Who are they, both in general, and very specifically by individual? They have no Wikipedia page. Their website is incredibly crude, with about three pages with virtually none of the most basic information one would expect (no "about us," "who we are," "our programs," "our constituent theatres," nada, bubkes.) Since all those theatres quit the Alliance en masse, I assume it's something the community could live without. While I detect a little "...and the horse you all rode in on!" followed by a door slam in the Alliance's abrupt press release, it doesn't sound as if the theatres were seeking resolution of the myriad issues – they split the scene; end of engagement and resolution – followed unsurprisingly by the "Alliance's" self-evaporation. I can't figure out if this "Alliance" was comparable to the Theatre Development Fund, or the Broadway League, or what – I guess a bit of both, but in the Wild West of LA Theatre, with its patchwork of mostly small theatres scattered a 500-square-mile town. I'd still be curious to know WHO the Alliance was – as in, human beings with names. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| New York Times coverage | |
| Posted by: singleticket 09:35 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: What WAS the L.A. Stage Alliance? - reed23 12:05 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| A bit more about the LA Theater Alliance: A variety of Los Angeles theater industry leaders interviewed Monday said the stage alliance was already in trouble financially before the latest conflagration, and its future had seemed uncertain throughout the pandemic... And several described a number of grievances with the organization, citing insufficient diversity in its leadership and programming, an ineffective response to the pandemic, high membership dues that made it harder for some theaters to participate, and a “pay to play” system in which theaters were supposed to pay a fee for each production they wanted considered for an award. |
|
| Link | LA Stage Alliance Disbands After Awards Ceremony Blunder |
| reply to this message | reply to first message | |
| Many thanks for the very helpful article! n/m | |
| Posted by: reed23 04:25 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: New York Times coverage - singleticket 09:35 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| Thanks singleticket and Singapore/Fling! | |
| Last Edit: WaymanWong 03:25 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| Posted by: WaymanWong 03:23 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: New York Times coverage - singleticket 09:35 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| Thanks for posting the link to Michael Paulson's N.Y. Times story, which gives a much fuller picture and makes it clear that L.A. Stage Alliance had its share of problems BEFORE the Ovation Awards. When I posted the original link to Deadline.com's more simplistic account, I suspected there had to be more to the story and that All That Chat regulars familiar with the situation, could offer more details. Thanks for your contributions to this thread! (On occasion, I've seen the L.A. Times' Charles McNulty post on All That Chat. I wonder if he'll weigh in on this, too!) |
|
| Link | L.A. Times: L.A. Stage Alliance shuts down in fallout from treatment of Asian actor |
| reply to this message | reply to first message | |
| re: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 11:56 pm EDT 04/05/21 | |
| In reply to: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards - WaymanWong 11:40 pm EDT 04/05/21 | |
|
|
|
| Putting up the wrong photo is hideous and unacceptable, but it's clear this is about consistent racist behavior. There are some institutions that won't be able to move forward with their current structure or leadership, and if no one is willing and able to take over and lead them in a new direction, they will fall. There is just too much racism in the upper levels of the white echelon that runs the arts for culture makers to continue silently and begrudgingly supporting it. The Alliance fell apart because they lost their legitimacy in the eyes of the theaters the Alliance was meant to serve, and they walked away. If the Alliance can't take the necessary steps to regain that legitimacy, then their only other choice is to dissolve. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards | |
| Last Edit: singleticket 11:13 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
| Posted by: singleticket 11:09 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: re: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards - Singapore/Fling 11:56 pm EDT 04/05/21 | |
|
|
|
| Putting up the wrong photo is hideous and unacceptable, but it's clear this is about consistent racist behavior. There are some institutions that won't be able to move forward with their current structure or leadership, and if no one is willing and able to take over and lead them in a new direction, they will fall. The problem is outrage is such a business in the US. It's almost as if Jully Lee and East West Players are being further victimized by being used as an excuse for a rather sleazy stage organization to disband itself. And then used again by being turned into culture war clickbait that will further enrich billionaire media moguls. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 01:49 pm EDT 04/06/21 | |
| In reply to: re: L.A. Stage Alliance is bowing out after gaffe at Ovation Awards - singleticket 11:09 am EDT 04/06/21 | |
|
|
|
| Agree with you there - a mixture of lazy reporting and sensational journalism turn this into "Award Show Makes One Mistake and Gets Cancelled", rather than "Organization with History of Racism Finally Loses the Support of Theater Community". | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
Time to render: 0.095915 seconds.