Threaded Order Chronological Order
| re: What?.... | |
| Posted by: portenopete 04:45 pm EDT 10/06/21 | |
| In reply to: re: What?.... - JT 02:44 pm EDT 10/06/21 | |
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| The tradition of casting Mrs. Brice: Kay Medford, Maureen Stapleton, Tyne Daly, Jayne Houdyshell: not one of them was/is Jewish. Who cares? They were- to varying degrees- all great. (Any record of Lillian Roth? Was she any better?) Valerie Harper and Nancy Walker were both shiksas who played probably the most iconic Jewish characters in mid-century American TV. The most-celebrated anti-Semite and anti-Catholic character Archie Bunker (and his UK equivalent Alf Garnett) were played by a Jew and a Catholic! Sean Penn was a deeply moving and accurate (as far as I can tell) Harvey Milk. I think it's great and adds verisimilitude when a role is played by someone with a lived experience similar to their character. And it's a good thing to open up the acting opportunities for marginalised communities. But "offensive"? Does a murderer have a right to gripe when they cast- as they inevitably do- a non-murderer as Jack the Ripper? Or a non-vampire as Dracula? |
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| re: Maureen Stapleton, Tyne Daly, Jayne Houdyshell did BIRDIE not FG | |
| Posted by: champagnesalesman 12:23 am EDT 10/07/21 | |
| In reply to: re: What?.... - portenopete 04:45 pm EDT 10/06/21 | |
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| Kay Medford did both Jackie Hoffman can definitely tone it down and be serious as in the recent FRUMA SARAH play. Randy Graff and Alix Korey(both Jewish) would have been great as Rose Brice and Strakosh in the Ambrose production they were about to start rehearsing when the plug was pulled. Carol Burnett told the producers of the original FG they needed a Jewish girl for the part to make it work. You could substitute NEW YORK for Jewish. as noted Bancroft believably did many times...Anne Meara also, similar to Medford. Beanie is from LA("out of town Jewish" to quote Neil Simon) Jane Lynch is very midwestern but she is sardonic. She's also 6 feet tall. Totally agree about GOLDEN GIRLS...the odds are ALL four of those women in Miami would have been Jewish. Fran Drescher said they wanted to make THE NANNY Italian too. |
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| Jerry Stiller on "Seinfeld" | |
| Posted by: PlayWiz 11:43 am EDT 10/07/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Maureen Stapleton, Tyne Daly, Jayne Houdyshell did BIRDIE not FG - champagnesalesman 12:23 am EDT 10/07/21 | |
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| Once saw him at a Lower East Side festival being interviewed, and they asked him about the name "Costanza", and he said something like "Yeah, that name wasn't quite appropriate for the family that was portrayed", especially since he and Alexander are Jewish (and the lady who played the Mom also looked like my Jewish aunt). | |
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| re: Jerry Stiller on "Seinfeld" | |
| Posted by: comedywest 11:56 am EDT 10/10/21 | |
| In reply to: Jerry Stiller on "Seinfeld" - PlayWiz 11:43 am EDT 10/07/21 | |
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| On Politically Incorrect in the 1990s, Bill Maher said to Jason Alexander that "your shows must be popular in the Middle East." and Alexander laughed and said, "I doubt a show about the problems of four self-absorbed Jews carries much weight in the Arab world." To be honest, I never thought of it that way. I always thought the show about four self-absorbed New Yorkers... |
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| In the case of "Seinfeld"... | |
| Last Edit: MockingbirdGirl 06:40 pm EDT 10/07/21 | |
| Posted by: MockingbirdGirl 06:39 pm EDT 10/07/21 | |
| In reply to: Jerry Stiller on "Seinfeld" - PlayWiz 11:43 am EDT 10/07/21 | |
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| ... the story I've always heard is that the NBC execs asked Larry David & Jerry Seinfeld not to make all of the characters Jewish, so George's last name was changed to Costanza... but they didn't change his character at all. Also, the Festivus "airing of grievances" might be the most Jewish thing ever. :) |
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| re: Maureen Stapleton, Tyne Daly, Jayne Houdyshell did BIRDIE not FG | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 12:32 am EDT 10/07/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Maureen Stapleton, Tyne Daly, Jayne Houdyshell did BIRDIE not FG - champagnesalesman 12:23 am EDT 10/07/21 | |
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| Totally agree about GOLDEN GIRLS...the odds are ALL four of those women in Miami would have been Jewish. Am I mistaken or didn't Blanche discover she had some Jewish lineage? |
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| re: Maureen Stapleton, Tyne Daly, Jayne Houdyshell did BIRDIE not FG | |
| Posted by: Thom915 03:47 pm EDT 10/07/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Maureen Stapleton, Tyne Daly, Jayne Houdyshell did BIRDIE not FG - Chromolume 12:32 am EDT 10/07/21 | |
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| Why? How many of my Irish aunts moved to Miami or North Miami? How many of my Italian friends? Quite a few! | |
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| re: Maureen Stapleton, Tyne Daly, Jayne Houdyshell did BIRDIE not FG | |
| Posted by: Roman 08:23 am EDT 10/07/21 | |
| In reply to: re: Maureen Stapleton, Tyne Daly, Jayne Houdyshell did BIRDIE not FG - Chromolume 12:32 am EDT 10/07/21 | |
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| A Feldman. From Buffalo. | |
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| re: What?.... | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 09:09 pm EDT 10/06/21 | |
| In reply to: re: What?.... - portenopete 04:45 pm EDT 10/06/21 | |
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| The tradition of casting Mrs. Brice: Kay Medford, Maureen Stapleton, Tyne Daly, Jayne Houdyshell: not one of them was/is Jewish. Much as I am ok with the casting in this case, I will also say that prior casting of any role is no longer a valid argument. In fact, it's exactly the wrong argument to make. |
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| re: What?.... | |
| Posted by: Delvino 07:34 pm EDT 10/06/21 | |
| In reply to: re: What?.... - portenopete 04:45 pm EDT 10/06/21 | |
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| I just came from the matinee of Hamilton (unexpected gift), and saw the expert Jin Ha play Burr, in a company with Latine and African-Americans in every major role. We live in a wonderful era with casting itself becoming an art form. I'm open to just about anyone playing any role. No exceptions. I probably was not quite so open as recently as 25 years ago. We grow, we evolve, and the industry does the same. | |
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| As an actress friend once said ... | |
| Posted by: Alcindoro 05:46 pm EDT 10/06/21 | |
| In reply to: re: What?.... - portenopete 04:45 pm EDT 10/06/21 | |
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| "You don't have to murder your kids to play Medea ... but I can see where it might help." | |
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| re: What?.... | |
| Posted by: MockingbirdGirl 05:02 pm EDT 10/06/21 | |
| In reply to: re: What?.... - portenopete 04:45 pm EDT 10/06/21 | |
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| Does a murderer have a right to gripe when they cast- as they inevitably do- a non-murderer as Jack the Ripper? Or a non-vampire as Dracula? Yes, it's a shame that out of the enormous pool of actors who have committed murder, none seem to be cast as either the Ripper or Dracula. The fact that you consider the subject to be facetious rather than worthy of serious consideration is duly noted. But recall how many people in this very forum spoke about how meaningful it was when the recent Boys in the Band was cast entirely with openly gay actors. Could it have been done with an all-straight cast? Sure. But for many people, the casting itself had significance and brought authenticity to the performances. Joe Mantello said: "I think having an out gay cast really did inform the work and it took on a particular kind of tone because of that, which is not to say that's the only way to approach this material. But for this particular group, it did something that I think is very, very special. There's a chemistry that they have." That's what people are talking about. It shouldn't be that difficult to empathize with the sentiment, even if you disagree with the practice. |
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| re: What?.... | |
| Posted by: portenopete 11:50 pm EDT 10/06/21 | |
| In reply to: re: What?.... - MockingbirdGirl 05:02 pm EDT 10/06/21 | |
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| "I think having an out gay cast really did inform the work and it took on a particular kind of tone because of that, which is not to say that's the only way to approach this material." You've helped confirm my point. It's great and good to cast Jews in Funny Girl. But it's not the ONLY way and I pity the folks who are "offended". I'm an openly gay man who liked the Transport Group's production of The Boys in the Band just as much as the Scott Rudin production. (Did his gayness make him a better producer of that show?) Cliff Gorman- for my money- can't be beaten as Emory and he was very straight, no? |
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