Threaded Order Chronological Order
| Perhaps the beginning of an unfortunate trend (Broadway "pause" for Mrs. Doubtfire) | |
| Posted by: Ncassidine 06:36 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| "Kevin McCollum, a veteran Broadway producer whose previous credits include “Rent” and “Avenue Q,” said he would close the musical comedy beginning Jan. 10, with a plan to reopen on March 14. The move will cost 115 people their jobs for that period; McCollum said he is committed to rehiring those who want to return." | |
| Link | https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/02/theater/mrs-doubtfire-broadway.html |
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| Is it beyond the ability of the producers to pay their companies a retainer fee? | |
| Posted by: portenopete 08:53 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
| In reply to: Perhaps the beginning of an unfortunate trend (Broadway "pause" for Mrs. Doubtfire) - Ncassidine 06:36 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| How many people are on the payroll? Are all of them eligible for unemployment insurance? What does that give them per week? What is a production contract minimum these days? | |
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| Does the theater owner still get paid the full rent during this hiatus? | |
| Posted by: aleck 09:59 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
| In reply to: Is it beyond the ability of the producers to pay their companies a retainer fee? - portenopete 08:53 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| Or do the lay offs only affect the salaried people? How does that work? | |
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| I have the same question. | |
| Posted by: wizrdofoz27 01:15 am EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: Does the theater owner still get paid the full rent during this hiatus? - aleck 09:59 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| I doubt any producer will be forthcoming with such details, but I'm very curious. Also curious how much it matters that the Sondheim is owned by Roundabout | |
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| re: I have the same question. | |
| Posted by: StageLover 06:47 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: I have the same question. - wizrdofoz27 01:15 am EST 01/03/22 | |
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| The Roundabout manages the Sondheim for its owners, The Durst Organization and the Bank of America. I'm sure they get a healthy fee for doing so. | |
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| re: I have the same question. | |
| Posted by: ryhog 09:53 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: I have the same question. - StageLover 06:47 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
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| my recollection is that RTC rents the theatre from Durst and that when RTC has a commercial subtenant, Durst gets a share of the percentage rent, not that it is a management arrangement. Unless the deal has been rewritten (or my memory is faulty). The terms of the rent (which is only the fixed rent obviously since the percentage rent would be $0) during a hiatus are a matter of negotiation. It is well to remember that (a) there are no rules and (b) there are especially no rules in the middle of a pandemic. From what I see, RTC has little if any motivation to not ride out a hiatus on agreeable terms. But I don't know. | |
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| re: I have the same question. | |
| Posted by: sirpupnyc 11:47 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: I have the same question. - ryhog 09:53 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
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| I've always seen it phrased as Roundabout "programs" the Sondheim. Ah, there's some more concrete information. Roundabout has a 20-year operating lease. They pay annual rent, additional for building expenses and "may be obligated to pay additional rent based on net rental income". Page 22 at the link below. |
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| Link | https://res.cloudinary.com/roundabout-theatre-company/image/upload/v1641241111/Development/Uploads/Roundabout_Theatre_Company_FINAL_Audit_8-31-21.pdf |
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| re: I have the same question. | |
| Posted by: ryhog 12:40 am EST 01/04/22 | |
| In reply to: re: I have the same question. - sirpupnyc 11:47 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
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| i am grateful that not everyone is as lazy as i am lately. :-) | |
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| re: I have the same question. | |
| Posted by: NewtonUK 09:44 am EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: I have the same question. - wizrdofoz27 01:15 am EST 01/03/22 | |
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| Hadestown will freeze over before theatreowners will lower their rent. That said, the bigger producers get a lot of favors that most producers don't, and Kevin is one of the biggest. He may have struck some kind of deal. Keep in miund that his decision puts out of work the House IATSE crew, doorman, box office staff. ushers, house manager, theatre manager, bar staff etc etc - all of whom are employees of the theatre, not the producer. (the orchestra are also employees of the theatre, but that's just Broadway bullshit that wont go away) | |
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| re: I have the same question. | |
| Posted by: ryhog 02:32 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: I have the same question. - NewtonUK 09:44 am EST 01/03/22 | |
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| You might recall that the "theatreowner" is RNT so generalizations are not especially apt. Also, your first sentence contradicts the next two. Among other defects noted elsewhere. |
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| "his decision puts out of work ... " | |
| Posted by: Ann 09:47 am EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: I have the same question. - NewtonUK 09:44 am EST 01/03/22 | |
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| As would permanently closing. Did you think Mrs. Doubtfire was going to stay open through January and February 2022? | |
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| re: "his decision puts out of work ... " | |
| Posted by: Delvino 01:09 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: "his decision puts out of work ... " - Ann 09:47 am EST 01/03/22 | |
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| And unless my memory has failed, Mrs. Doubtfire's survival was far from a sure thing. It was panned in the Times, and had mixed (at best) reviews elsewhere. A presumption that a hit was suspended unfairly seems a leap. It was on TDF and TKTS like all other shows, both of which I checked twice a day. This was a production that might've struggled without a pandemic (see Tootsie). | |
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| re: Is it beyond the ability of the producers to pay their companies a retainer fee? | |
| Posted by: sirpupnyc 09:12 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
| In reply to: Is it beyond the ability of the producers to pay their companies a retainer fee? - portenopete 08:53 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| They're taking this break (in part) because they don't believe they can take in enough to meet costs. Payroll is a large part of the weekly nut. So with no income, it's a safe guess that they can't afford to keep paying, if staying up through the lean weeks would mean closing. I've wondered about the unemployment thing lately, but haven't allowed myself to look it up (because if the shows stop, I stop, too). With a short time back to work after a long time drawing unemployment, I'm not sure the answers are good. But NY's max is $504/week, a long way from production contract minimum. |
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| re: Is it beyond the ability of the producers to pay their companies a retainer fee? | |
| Posted by: stgmgr 12:50 am EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Is it beyond the ability of the producers to pay their companies a retainer fee? - sirpupnyc 09:12 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| With so many in the arts having been out of work for so long, there's no guarantee that the affected workers will have accrued enough work weeks to qualify to collect unemployment. So even that $504 max isn't a sure thing. | |
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| It used to be two weeks until unemployment is paid | |
| Posted by: dramedy 09:38 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Is it beyond the ability of the producers to pay their companies a retainer fee? - sirpupnyc 09:12 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| A layoff from a show should qualify. They would have to actively looking for a new job but there probably isn’t much available now for actors. “Did you bullshit last week, did you bullshit this week, did you try to bullshit this week”. History of the world when Mel brooks sought unemployment in Roman times for stand up comic and bea Arthur said those great lines. |
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| re: It used to be two weeks until unemployment is paid | |
| Posted by: fosse76 12:28 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: It used to be two weeks until unemployment is paid - dramedy 09:38 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| A layoff from a show would qualify...but they must have 6 months of work previous to the layoff. No shows qualify for that. | |
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| The website says 12 months. | |
| Posted by: dramedy 03:21 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: It used to be two weeks until unemployment is paid - fosse76 12:28 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
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| I didn’t realize there was that requirement. Most actors rarely qualify unless it’s a hit show that runs a year. | |
| Link | https://www.benefits.gov/benefit/1771 |
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| re: The website says 12 months. | |
| Posted by: fosse76 03:44 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: The website says 12 months. - dramedy 03:21 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
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| It looks like they reduced it to one quarter (3 months) for 2021. Many shows still won't qualify. | |
| Link | https://dol.ny.gov/you-apply-unemployment-frequently-asked-questions |
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| I see it as very fortunate | |
| Posted by: ryhog 07:40 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
| In reply to: Perhaps the beginning of an unfortunate trend (Broadway "pause" for Mrs. Doubtfire) - Ncassidine 06:36 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| I just wish that it were happening universally; nothing else makes sense. | |
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| I wonder what grosses were | |
| Posted by: dramedy 09:42 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
| In reply to: I see it as very fortunate - ryhog 07:40 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| In the beginning of December. I doubt the reviews built much advance. But going on hiatus is better than closing and closer to tonys for publicity reopening. | |
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| It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 09:41 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
| In reply to: I see it as very fortunate - ryhog 07:40 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| Or if Equity and IATSE demanded some sort of back pay when (if) the show re-opens in March. As it is, the show is closing for the winter, and I kind of wonder if this might become another tactic that producers take in the future to save costs during the doldrums. | |
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| re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" | |
| Last Edit: KingSpeed 04:27 am EST 01/03/22 | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 04:25 am EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" - Singapore/Fling 09:41 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| If I’m Rob McClure, I’d head to L.A. and try to get a TV show. Unless they’re paying him a lot not to. There are so many TV shows nowadays and he’s very talented. | |
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| re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" | |
| Posted by: JereNYC (JereNYC@aol.com) 05:01 pm EST 01/06/22 | |
| In reply to: re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" - KingSpeed 04:25 am EST 01/03/22 | |
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| He was very good guest starring for a couple of episodes on the Spectrum Original series THE BITE last year alongside, among others, Audra McDonald, Taylor Schilling, Steven Pasquale, Phillipa Soo, Will Swenson, and Leslie Uggams. | |
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| re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" | |
| Posted by: ryhog 10:05 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
| In reply to: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" - Singapore/Fling 09:41 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| This year is not every year, and this is not the garden variety doldrums. Or at least let's hope it's not how the garden grows in the future. The parties could have negotiated something here but there is a lack of leadership on both sides, as I have discussed ad nauseum. Beyond that, and this addresses your other post as well, let's be real here: the only alternative is shutting down for good. And we will see the same thing play out with a lot of other shows. And the rich guys who stay open may well be hurt long term too. Not a good situation but this is the closest thing to leadership I've seen since the word omicron entered our consciousness. I have had my issues with Kevin but I have to give him credit here. He stepped forward when everyone else was staring at the floor. We've known all along that this winter was going to be brutal. Omicron has made it many times worse. As I keep saying, expect a dozen shows to survive. If fast forwarding to spring gives Doubtfire a fighting chance, good on them. Ask the ATP company if they would have preferred this. |
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| re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" | |
| Last Edit: Delvino 11:15 am EST 01/03/22 | |
| Posted by: Delvino 11:13 am EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" - ryhog 10:05 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| Well (and bluntly, necessarily) said. We may look back at this post as the pragmatic POV ultimately embraced by everyone. Of course, we live in an era characterized by normalizing that which is not normal, so it shouldn't surprise us that some people want to pretend that because Broadway came back it can no longer behave with a sense of responsibility befitting changing circumstances. As protocols have been mutable, so must we all adapt to new economic circumstances, compromise in economic models. Leadership matters now, and I've learned much watching those who've stepped up to demonstrate even a modicum. In an industry wherein "no one knows anything," perhaps we know even less, thanks to this pandemic. That's a useful starting place in early 2020: acceptance. | |
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| re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 12:08 am EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" - ryhog 10:05 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| What leadership are you seeing? Considering that he’s keeping “Six” running, what is he doing aside from cutting losses on his underperforming show until ticket sales might be more favorable? | |
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| re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" | |
| Posted by: ryhog 12:38 am EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" - Singapore/Fling 12:08 am EST 01/03/22 | |
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| He is trying something other than just folding up his tent. He has negotiated something with the unions, which is more than the league has done. He has charted a path that hopefully some others will be able to follow. I don't see this as the ideal way forward but it is better than nothing. I don't think you appreciate how perilous things are. There is no choice available for a bunch of shows to run through the winter. It's do something like this or close. That is not a better outcome. And yes if we take your what is he doing aside from question, he is trying to save a show. 2022 is not going to be "normal." I think I know what is motivating your reaction but what positive outcome is possible at the end of your alternative. It seems like you want the production to lose $10mil to keep everyone employed. That's not an option; they don't have the money to do that. So what then? |
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| re: what did he negotiate with unions? | |
| Posted by: kidmanboy 06:47 am EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" - ryhog 12:38 am EST 01/03/22 | |
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| What was negotiated with the unions? It would seem as far as the staff of the show is concerned the show closes 1/10. From everything I was read no one is getting paid or under any contractual obligation beyond that point. | |
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| re: what did he negotiate with unions? | |
| Posted by: ryhog 01:41 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: what did he negotiate with unions? - kidmanboy 06:47 am EST 01/03/22 | |
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| Specifically, I do not know because it has not been shared tmk. But obviously something. Otherwise, this "suspension" would be a closure and treated as such, as would the reopening. I am endlessly mystified by the reactions of some people to this (and lots more things). Would you have preferred if he just packed his bags and went home? This (like many other shows) have no choice but to close. This is an effort to keep it alive, if on life support. What ulterior motive are you seeing in this action? I just can't fathom the mindset. |
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| re: what did he negotiate with unions? | |
| Posted by: kidmanboy 06:09 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: what did he negotiate with unions? - ryhog 01:41 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
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| I have nothing against this move for this particular show. I just don’t think it’s particularly novel (I do believe it is just closing while selling tickets for March in hopes it’s able to reopen) and don’t agree with some that it should be applied to every show as a new business model. It is much better to keep people employed if the ticket sales are there. As a local who has seen several shows already and has tickets for several more this winter, I haven’t seen Mrs Doubtfire and don’t intend to. I do think the increase in sales come spring is a bit of wishful thinking. |
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| re: what did he negotiate with unions? | |
| Posted by: fosse76 03:50 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: what did he negotiate with unions? - ryhog 01:41 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
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| Based on the language he used, it seems like a closure in all but name. The show hasn't been running that long since reopening, so there are presumably no contract expirations that would occur during the hiatus which necessitates the language that anyone who wants to return can. My guess is that the negotiation resulted in an agreement that the union wouldn't sue over the hiatus, provided the actors are rehired under current contract conditions. |
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| re: what did he negotiate with unions? | |
| Posted by: ryhog 08:04 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: what did he negotiate with unions? - fosse76 03:50 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
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| just a couple of observations. (1) there are lots of poeple employed besides actors on term contracts. (2)I think there are a lot of fine points to be negotiated. E.g., rehearsals. (3) there is significant expense to the production arising from this approach. No one would do that without the intention (perhaps wishful) of reopening at the end of it. and yes, couple=3. :-) |
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| re: what did he negotiate with unions? | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 09:45 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: what did he negotiate with unions? - ryhog 08:04 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
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| What are the significant expenses of this approach? Too many of us, it looks as if this is a way to freeze paying for the show while they await better days. And how much do you think McCollum will be spending on the show during the hiatus? | |
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| re: what did he negotiate with unions? | |
| Posted by: ryhog 10:08 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: what did he negotiate with unions? - Singapore/Fling 09:45 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
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| theatre rent and a bunch of pass-throughs like utilities, maintenance, etc, insurance, equipment rental, off the top of my head. And assuming things don't take a turn for the worse, there are also rehearsal expenses (of some length), casting, repairs and a lot more. Give me an hour and I'll spend more. :-) I have no idea how much but I would say 6 figures approaching 7. Curious if anyone else has an answer here. | |
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| re: what did he negotiate with unions? | |
| Last Edit: writerkev 06:22 am EST 01/04/22 | |
| Posted by: writerkev 06:21 am EST 01/04/22 | |
| In reply to: re: what did he negotiate with unions? - ryhog 10:08 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
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| I imagine they’ll need some baseline level of advertising at some point to keep it in the public’s mind, make the reopening seem real, and support advance sales for March. | |
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| re: what did he negotiate with unions? | |
| Posted by: Ann 08:31 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: what did he negotiate with unions? - ryhog 08:04 pm EST 01/03/22 | |
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| That's a throuple. | |
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| re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 12:58 am EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" - ryhog 12:38 am EST 01/03/22 | |
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| I appreciate how perilous things are, and I understand why he’s decided to lay off cast and crew with the promise to re-hire…. and if the show re-opens and is still running a year from now, I may tip my hat to him. What I question is calling this “very fortunate” and praising McCollum as a leader for provisionally closing his show. |
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| re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" | |
| Posted by: ryhog 01:12 am EST 01/03/22 | |
| In reply to: re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" - Singapore/Fling 12:58 am EST 01/03/22 | |
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| because it is a better outcome than anyone else has planned, plain and simple | |
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| re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" | |
| Last Edit: mikem 11:22 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
| Posted by: mikem 11:22 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
| In reply to: re: It'd be very fortunate if cast and crew were paid during the "hiatus" - ryhog 10:05 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| It certainly appears that the show has no other choice. I was also wondering if, once the pandemic is over, other shows might want to take a mid-winter hiatus. Financially in "normal" times, it may or may not make sense because presumably the show would still have to pay rent, and the stop clause might be invoked. Right now, I'm guessing that there's no line of shows waiting to take over the theater, so the landlord is willing to work with the Doubtfire producers. But in "normal" times, the landlord might just give the house to some other show rather than get minimum rent. | |
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| re: I see it as very fortunate | |
| Posted by: kidmanboy 08:24 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
| In reply to: I see it as very fortunate - ryhog 07:40 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| It doesn’t really make sense for the shows that are continuing to make money or have enough money in the bank to not risk losing their entire staff… | |
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| re: Perhaps the beginning of an unfortunate trend (Broadway "pause" for Mrs. Doubtfire) | |
| Last Edit: PlazaBoy 06:53 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
| Posted by: PlazaBoy 06:51 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
| In reply to: Perhaps the beginning of an unfortunate trend (Broadway "pause" for Mrs. Doubtfire) - Ncassidine 06:36 pm EST 01/02/22 | |
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| It seems like a sensible approach. I'm unlikely to want to it in a theater until things calm a bit. I imagine I'm not alone. | |
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