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| Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: theaterisok 02:20 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| I am asking this as serious question, hoping those who are really invested in theater criticism and analysis to help me understand what I was missing with this show? Frank Rich writes how brilliant it is. What did I miss? I listened to the radio interview with the three authors. There was nothing about their explanations that helped to illuminate what I was experiencing in the theater. What questions would you ask yourself to better understand a show? |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: jjbkvm 08:51 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
| In reply to: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - theaterisok 02:20 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| Just be happy you got to see it. Going on Wednesday I’ll be happy to love it or hate it! Can’t wait. |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: theaterisok 11:45 am EST 01/09/22 | |
| In reply to: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - theaterisok 02:20 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| Thank you everyone for your truly thoughtful and insightful responses. For reference, Frank Rich. Posted the following on his Facebook page on Dec 21: Don't be a theatergoer who two years, or ten, from now "wished" they'd been there. Flying Over Sunset is a brilliant culmination of James Lapine's work in "Twelve Dreams," "Sunday in the Park" and "Into the Woods." I can't wait to see again. Lincoln Center Theater |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Last Edit: Chazwaza 07:23 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
| Posted by: Chazwaza 07:22 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - theaterisok 11:45 am EST 01/09/22 | |
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| thank you for posting that! I googled to see what you'd referred to but only found Jesse Green's considerably less favorable review (though not as bad as many). I didn't love it as much or hold it in quite as high an esteem as Rich did, but I'm closer to his opinion than most it seems. |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: DRNY 07:05 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - theaterisok 11:45 am EST 01/09/22 | |
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| Just home from my 4th time. Such a brillant theatre piece. Had to see it again. Happily the audience was estatic like myself. | |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: Chatty2007 07:28 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - DRNY 07:05 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
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| Both these reactions are ridiculous and useless in critiquing the show. There are flaws in the show, but "hate" it? See it four times - what are you, crazy? (Also, get a life.) I've been going to the theater for 50 years and there is VERY little on Broadway I would say I hated or wanted to see four times. (Maybe four times in a lifetime, but not in a matter of weeks or months.) Reactions like these are ruining Broadway, as far as I'm concerned. Everything is the worst or the greatest thing you've ever seen. By "you" I'm talking to all the people on this board who constantly have reactions like this, as well as the "kids" (i.e., teens and young people) just starting to see live professional theater. We need more measured responses. |
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| makes me think of the blob in Merrily | |
| Last Edit: Chazwaza 11:36 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
| Posted by: Chazwaza 11:35 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - Chatty2007 07:28 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
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| It's the worst, it's the greatest, it's least, it's the only, it's the perfect hi!- dreadful/fabulous! etc, i don't remember them all off the top of my head. |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: showtunetrivia 09:31 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - Chatty2007 07:28 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
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| This is a board for theatre lovers. If those here are enthusiastic about a show or detest it, they’re free to say so. How these favorable or unfavorable reactions are “ruining Broadway” is beyond me. Those posters are out there; they’re seeing shows and expressing their opinions of those shows, not “measured” academic analyses. There are shows I enjoyed so much, I have loved the chance to see them multiple times, but my finances have always been such that I was thankful for one. In the case of FLYING OVER SUNSET, it’s going to close soon. What’s your beef with a fan of that show taking advantage of the few opportunities left to see it? Talk about “getting a life.” I’m in Los Angeles, and will have to content myself with the cast album. Laura |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: DRNY 08:05 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - Chatty2007 07:28 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
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| Your measured response !!! it wasn't. remember no one cares but you | |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: Chatty2007 08:15 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - DRNY 08:05 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
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| Huh? Are you talking to me personally, or in general? Because "no one cares but you" is kind of odd to say on a MESSAGE board. My response was measured, because I could have been saying it nonstop for the past 10 years - every time somebody on the board proclaims something the greatest or worst or I couldn't take another minute and had to leave in the middle or went back to see it 15 times. Those are ridiculous responses to have more than once or twice in a lifetime of theatergoing. Also, my response was NOT to the show. |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 11:53 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - Chatty2007 08:15 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
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| The irony here is that you are accusing people of being hyperbolically passionate in a series of posts that are hyperbolically passionate. I don’t do as much repeat viewing now as I did when I was younger, but I wouldn’t be the theater maker that I am if I hadn’t seen some shows anywhere from 2 - 4 times when I in my late teens. |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: bobjohnny 07:05 am EST 01/09/22 | |
| In reply to: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - theaterisok 02:20 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| Where did Frank Rich write about "Flying Over Sunset"? The show has a good first act and a rather dismal second act. | |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: Delvino 09:10 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
| In reply to: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - theaterisok 02:20 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| I've felt that way about so many pieces that others love ("Book of Mormon*" exhausted and depleted me by the middle of act two; it was finally witless and disturbingly ugly to my eyes and ears. And I like the score). We're all unable to feel anything -- but what we feel. *Please don't tell me the ways that Book of Mormon is superior craftsmanship to Sunset. I'm talking personal response to the imagery in text and songs. |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: seenenuf 08:57 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
| In reply to: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - theaterisok 02:20 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| Maybe you are not missing anything at all. Perhaps your dislike stems from the fact that you did not experience any connection with the characters, and their struggles. No fault there. Two and half hours with people you have no connection with can be brutal. It is a difficult show. I found it very hard to care for the characters, and their situations, as presented. Where was the sense of fun, or adventure? The NPR interview with the creators seems at a vast disconnect from what I witnessed on stage. I was bored most of the time. And that is the worst thing to be in the theatre. I don't think you missed anything. |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: dreamawakening 07:01 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
| In reply to: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - theaterisok 02:20 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| That's easy! Because the show was bad and you're never getting those hours of your life back. |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: NewsGuy 04:56 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
| In reply to: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - theaterisok 02:20 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| I've had the same experience with a few shows - read the comments here, critical praise, social media praise, and others, and heard nothing but praise and how wonderful a particular show comes to mind. I go, sit there, and then absolutely hate it. It's interesting because over time afterwards, sometimes my opinion changes and then I come to realize/see what the brilliance was. An example of this being "Indecent" a few years ago at the Cort. Then some shows just never cross over that line for me - as is the case with "Rent." I just never got into it back then and still am not into it now. *shrug* |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: Musicals54 04:35 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
| In reply to: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - theaterisok 02:20 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| the important word is 'hate.' I had tickets for it (gave then to friends) as I didn't want to go into the city (covid). My problem with the idea for the show is that an acid trip is intensely personal. I suppose you could do it as a dream ballet. 3 dream ballets would be a big deal for Act 2. As well, the relationship among the three leading characters is non existent in reality and in the show. Mary Stuart and Queen Elizabeth never met, but in the play, they do. No attempt was made, I gather, to connect the characters except as users of a recreational/therapeutic drug. I gather there was a terrific tap number. I also gather the conflicts were within each character. But hate. It was a failure. An honest one. It wasn't In My Life or Into the Light or Hit The Trail. | |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: PurpleMoney 04:24 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
| In reply to: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - theaterisok 02:20 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| Think of what words you used. You hated it, that's great. You had an emotional response. I hated it was well but I liked so much of what I did see and the journey I went on. I wouldn't rush out to see it again ask it was not satisfying on an emotional level. I felt the first act was wonderful but the second act was not able to take us on that LSD journey and feel an personal connection to their stories. |
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| I ask myself that about Cats all the time | |
| Posted by: dramedy 03:07 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
| In reply to: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - theaterisok 02:20 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| Played for almost two decades—how? | |
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| re: I ask myself that about Cats all the time | |
| Posted by: mikem 02:50 pm EST 01/09/22 | |
| In reply to: I ask myself that about Cats all the time - dramedy 03:07 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| I know there are people on this board who will strongly disagree, but I would say that Cats isn't that bad, but from the 2022 perspective, it also isn't that great. I wasn't surprised the 2016 revival didn't last that long, but the original opened 40 years ago and closed over 20 years ago. I think some hit shows seem to have self-fulfilling momentum because they are hit shows. Kinky Boots is a recent example of that for me. I enjoyed it enough, but it's the 26th longest-running Broadway show of all time, just above The Producers, Beautiful, Annie, and the Mendes Cabaret, and just below Hairspray, Aladdin, Mary Poppins, and Avenue Q. I can understand why its neighbors are so popular, but I find Kinky Boots to be a head-scratcher. Kinky Boots is well-done but I don't think any of its elements are outstanding enough to explain that level of popularity (IMO, of course). |
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| re: I ask myself that about Cats all the time | |
| Last Edit: BroadwayTonyJ 04:50 am EST 01/09/22 | |
| Posted by: BroadwayTonyJ 04:48 am EST 01/09/22 | |
| In reply to: I ask myself that about Cats all the time - dramedy 03:07 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| The show opened to great acclaim on Broadway in '82, won all the awards, and found significant appeal with a wide audience that was multigenerational. I was late to the game when I saw a tour that hit Chicago in '89. My future partner (who was 20 years younger than I) wanted to see it. A number of years later I was dating this young twink, who was obsessed with the show, but had never seen a stage production. We ended up catching another tour which came to the burbs in Oct., '95 -- the cast included J. Robert Spencer as the Rum Tum Tugger. In Oct., 2003 I took my sister and niece to see a local production of Cats at the Lincolnshire Marriott. It was an excellent staging and probably my favorite of the 3 times I have seen this musical. Because it ran so long on Broadway, Cats became a joke, especially to most people who post on a message board like ATC. Nevertheless, I'm not ashamed to admit I that I do like the show -- it's slight, but enjoyable. However, I rarely listen to the cast recording and have no interest in ever seeing it again. |
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| re: I ask myself that about Cats all the time | |
| Posted by: garyd 11:16 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
| In reply to: I ask myself that about Cats all the time - dramedy 03:07 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| I enjoyed Cats though not enough to see it more than once. It was fun, entertaining, sweet, and, yes, ultimately, pseudo- melodramatic, but in a goofy sort of way. The ascent into the "otherly layer" or whatever the devil it was called, just made me grin. It was just a story about cats and, let's face it, gave ALW his best of career lyrics. That being said, I have not answered your question. I have no idea why it ran "now and forever". Or, maybe I have. | |
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| re: I ask myself that about Cats all the time | |
| Posted by: schauspieler 04:06 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
| In reply to: I ask myself that about Cats all the time - dramedy 03:07 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| I'll never forget the experience of seeing that show. WTF? I felt like I'd been transported back in time into an episode of HULLABALOO! | |
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| re: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 03:04 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
| In reply to: Why did I hate "Flying Over Sunset?" - theaterisok 02:20 pm EST 01/08/22 | |
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| To better understand the show on its terms, I think you have to take what the authors are telling you their goals are, and build the best argument you can for how they achieved those goals. What elements in the writing and the production support and tell that story or experience? What journey do the characters go on that supports that story, and what does that tell you about humanity? If the show has a Big Message, what is it? That’s a quick way to figure out the show’s intentions, and it also gives you an entry point to then evaluate how well it achieved its goals. Seeing what the creators intended, how well do you feel they pulled it off? That’s a somewhat different question than why you didn’t like it. To then explore that, you can dig into your tastes and what you prize in a successful play. You might dig into some books or videos about story structure and dramaturgy, and you might also look at plays that you feel successfully told the story or experience that this show didn’t. |
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