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| re: OKLAHOMA! Revival (in Chicago) -- Tuesday Night: A Pleasant Surprise (Probable Spoilers) | |
| Posted by: ChicagoDRO 03:10 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
| In reply to: OKLAHOMA! Revival (in Chicago) -- Tuesday Night: A Pleasant Surprise (Probable Spoilers) - BroadwayTonyJ 11:26 am EST 01/20/22 | |
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| I saw the chicago tour twice- subscriber ticket and lottery. I enjoyed the show even more the second time. The director made many interesting choices- most worked some didn’t. I was interested in my audience responses. I rode the bus home with five people aged 20-30ish and they all enjoyed the show but most had not seen a more traditional production or the movie yet. The user told me 100 people left at intermission (even before seeing the ballet- which I did not really enjoy). For my lottery ticket I sat next to 3 theatre students and they also enjoyed the show. I can say I saw the 1979 production at The Arie Crown Theatre and a production at Marriott. All memorable in there own way but this new production really opened the door for some great conversations. I’m glad Chicago took a chance at hosting the show- it’s not for everyone, but it seems to be bringing younger people to the production and in turn making them ask questions and researching history. |
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| re: OKLAHOMA! Revival (in Chicago) -- Tuesday Night: A Pleasant Surprise (Probable Spoilers) | |
| Posted by: BroadwayTonyJ 08:40 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
| In reply to: re: OKLAHOMA! Revival (in Chicago) -- Tuesday Night: A Pleasant Surprise (Probable Spoilers) - ChicagoDRO 03:10 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
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| My partner is African-American and 20 years younger than I am. He loved this version easily as much as I did. We have seen at least 3 more traditional productions of Oklahoma! at various Chicago area venues over the years, including at the Marriott and Chicago Lyric Opera. The comments we heard from people sitting near us were very positive, but a lot of folks did leave at intermission. Did you see Hamilton or Wynn in the dream ballet when you attended the two performances? |
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| A scathing review | |
| Posted by: pfolson 06:01 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
| In reply to: re: OKLAHOMA! Revival (in Chicago) -- Tuesday Night: A Pleasant Surprise (Probable Spoilers) - ChicagoDRO 03:10 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
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| This is one of the harshest reviews I've seen in a long time. | |
| Link | I don't think they enjoyed the show |
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| Is Hammerstein often referred to as "Jr."? | |
| Last Edit: Ann 07:04 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
| Posted by: Ann 07:02 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
| In reply to: A scathing review - pfolson 06:01 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
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| I thought it was always II. That's as far as I got, but "... a travesty of a mockery of a sham" sounds like a bad Hammerstein parody, but of course is a Woody Allen ripoff. |
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| It should only be Oscar Hammerstein II | |
| Last Edit: BroadwayTonyJ 07:37 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
| Posted by: BroadwayTonyJ 07:34 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
| In reply to: Is Hammerstein often referred to as "Jr."? - Ann 07:02 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
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| The suffix "Jr." is used when a boy is named after his father. The suffix "II" is used when a boy is named after a grandfather, uncle, or another male relative. Oscar was named after his grandfather. His father's name was William. |
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| To be expected from Hedy Weiss... | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 06:21 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
| In reply to: A scathing review - pfolson 06:01 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
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| ... the reviewer whose racist take down of the original production of "Pass Over" put that play in the national conversation and sparked a conversation in Chicago about the way Weiss had used racial stereotypes in her writing in ways that Ike Holter said amounted to Hate Speech. | |
| Link | The Review That Shook Chicago |
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| re: To be expected from Hedy Weiss... | |
| Posted by: whereismikeyfl 11:32 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
| In reply to: To be expected from Hedy Weiss... - Singapore/Fling 06:21 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
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| Most of Weiss's more outrageous reviews are no longer available on the internet. (Her review of Wicked was my favorite.) But her bizarre biases and accusations were long a feature of Chicago arts journalism. She is very smart, but has a number of triggers. |
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| Hedy Weiss Theatre Review -- the Wrong Place for What She Wrote | |
| Last Edit: BroadwayTonyJ 08:06 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
| Posted by: BroadwayTonyJ 07:57 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
| In reply to: To be expected from Hedy Weiss... - Singapore/Fling 06:21 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
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| Hedy Weiss is not a racist. She should not have stated those sentiments in a theatre review. Most of the young black kids that get murdered every year are killed by black drug dealers or black gang bangers. Every black mother knows this to be true. As a former high school teacher and baseball coach, I got to know a number of parents and guys who lost a son or daughter or sibling to gang violence. The initiation ritual into some black gangs in Chicago is to kidnap the young son of a former gang member, take him into an alley, and blow his brains out. Pass Over is a great play. Weiss should have reviewed the work itself and saved the rest of her remarks for the commentary page of the editorial section. |
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| re: Hedy Weiss Theatre Review -- What She Wrote Was Wrong | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 08:35 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
| In reply to: Hedy Weiss Theatre Review -- the Wrong Place for What She Wrote - BroadwayTonyJ 07:57 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
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| Statistically, most people who are murdered are murdered by somebody of their own race. That does not change the reality of systemic state violence against Black bodies by police officers, nor does it change the way that White society benefits from that systemic state violence, which was explicitly stated in the final moments of the Chicago Pass Over, to which Weiss responded using racist language. The issue, as many of us saw it, wasn't that she didn't review the work itself - she did - it's that the work elicited a racist response from her, and the only way she knew how to condemn the play was by using the racist canard of "Black on Black crime" to refute the point the show was making. And it's not just Weiss. Dave Harris shared on his IG that after the first preview of Tambo and Bones last night, a White audience member stormed out of the theater, flipped over a table in the lobby, knocked down a hand sanitizing station, and then literally pulled a planter off a sidewalk and dumped it on the street. At least Weiss' violence was limited to words. |
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| re: Hedy Weiss Theatre Review -- What She Wrote Was Wrong | |
| Posted by: BroadwayTonyJ 08:50 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Hedy Weiss Theatre Review -- What She Wrote Was Wrong - Singapore/Fling 08:35 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
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| My feeling is that you have to put the problem in perspective. 600 to 700 black people die every year in Chicago due to violence perpetrated by black gangs and black drug dealers. Every few years in Chicago, a single unarmed black person is killed unjustifiably by a white cop. Both occurrences are horrendous, but which problem is more immediate and deserves the most action and resources. My answer to you is talk to more black people that live in neighborhoods like the West and South Sides of Chicago. That's what I have done most of my adult life, especially when I was teaching and coaching. Weiss wrote something that didn't belong in a theatre review. That doesn't make her a racist. |
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| re: Hedy Weiss Theatre Review -- What She Wrote Was Wrong | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 02:42 pm EST 01/21/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Hedy Weiss Theatre Review -- What She Wrote Was Wrong - BroadwayTonyJ 08:50 pm EST 01/20/22 | |
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| I hear you, though I’m unclear why you think the specific medium Weiss uses to express racist thoughts would determine the content of those racist thoughts. There are many paths we can take to discuss the ways that Black lives are not valued in this country. The issues of violence within the Black community in Chicago are one reflection of that, but we can consider that alongside the equally important issue of police officers murdering Black men, women, and children. There’s no reason to use one to negate the other, which is what Weiss did. Her reaction - specifically her need to blame Black people and exonerate White people in discussing violence against Black bodies - speaks for itself, whether she’s writing a review or an op-ed (which in a way, what is a critical response but an op-ed?). |
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| re: Hedy Weiss Theatre Review -- 2 Paragraphs Do Not Belong in a Review of PASS OVER | |
| Posted by: BroadwayTonyJ 09:04 pm EST 01/21/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Hedy Weiss Theatre Review -- What She Wrote Was Wrong - Singapore/Fling 02:42 pm EST 01/21/22 | |
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| OK, I read her full review. There are 2 paragraphs that she should not have included in a theatre review. As I said before, they belong on the commentary section of the editorial page. They are about the black on black violence in Chicago's black community and not specifically about what happens in the play. Weiss is a social conservative, but that doesn't mean she's a racist. What she is saying is very provocative, but IMO she is just stating truthfully what she sees happening every day in Chicago. The black on black violence in the city is very complex. There is a lot of poverty, a huge amount of homelessness, rampant drug dealing, and an intractable gang problem. Weiss' comments over simplify all of those factors. Nevertheless, they are legitimate opinions. Quite frankly, I hear opinions (like those of Weiss) every day from members of my own family and from members of my partner's family, the vast majority of whom are people of color, black, Asian, and Latino. They are conservative opinions. I don't completely agree with them (mine are much more nuanced), but IMO they are not racist. |
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| re: Hedy Weiss Theatre Review -- What She Wrote Was Wrong | |
| Last Edit: BroadwayTonyJ 08:10 pm EST 01/21/22 | |
| Posted by: BroadwayTonyJ 08:07 pm EST 01/21/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Hedy Weiss Theatre Review -- What She Wrote Was Wrong - Singapore/Fling 02:42 pm EST 01/21/22 | |
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| I've been trying to read Weiss' review of Pass Over but I only get a few seconds to see it and then I get hit by a paywall. Do you know of a website where I can read it carefully to see what you are talking about? What I did read was strong language that didn't belong in a theatre review. She used phrases that you don't like, but I wouldn't consider those words racist. That's just your opinion. Frankly IMO you throw that word around much too freely on ATC. However, I need to be able to read her review without a paywall. Is that possible? Full disclosure, for a number of years (but not recently) I used to communicate with Weiss via e-mail. I'm certain that I know her better then you do. She is not a racist. She has strong opinions with which you disagree, but she knows what she is talking about. As far as I know, she has lived in Chicago most of her life. Of course, there are racist white cops in America. There are racist people in every line of work everywhere. However, there is no reliable, concrete evidence that white cops murder black women and children. That is absurd. Did you ever hear Barack Obama make a statement like that or Kamala Harris or Joe Biden? Of course, there are cases where white cops make a mistake and break into the wrong home or something like that, and as a result, black women and children are killed. There are also cases where a young black kid is carrying a gun, is told to drop the gun by a white cop, does not do it, and is killed. That's not murder. That's a tragedy, but you can't say the cop is a racist. Unfortunately, in a city like Chicago that sort of thing happens much too often, but usually the cop is black, and then black journalists like Don Lemon, Soledad O'Brien, and Joy Reid don't want to talk about it. In Chicago over the last 5 years I believe there have only been 2 cases in which a white cop unjustifiably killed an unarmed black man. I agree that those are horrendous acts and we have to stop such things from happening. There definitely have been various cases nationwide in the last 5 years where white cops unjustifiably killed an unarmed black man. I watch CNN and MSNBC every day and I've seen the coverage of those instances. They are terrible and we must work to stop them. However, what is the total number of those cases in the last 5 years? Maybe something like 20 or 30, possibly fewer? One black person murdered by a white cop is one too many but how can you compare that to the hundreds, possibly thousands of black individuals murdered every year in cities like Chicago by black gangs and black drug dealers. No matter how you look at it, that is black on black crime, and that is a much more serious problem in our society than anything else. Ask any black person who lives in a city like Chicago, and they will agree with that statement. There is not a single white community in America that has anywhere near a murder rate like that. |
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