Threaded Order Chronological Order
| "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." | |
| Posted by: reed23 04:25 am EDT 03/19/22 | |
| In reply to: Billy Porter injects life into “The Life” and Ledisi stops the show - Singapore/Fling 11:24 pm EDT 03/18/22 | |
|
|
|
| While I’m glad you liked it – and yours is the first and only positive reaction I’ve read in an overwhelming fusillade of reactions ranging from eye-rolling to poor to furious – I’m wondering about your comment that the original score “lacked the grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to.” Since Cy Coleman co-produced the original, co-wrote the book to the original, composed the original, and co-arranged the vocals, and co-arranged the dance music, I’m curious why you thought the score “aspired” to a “grit, funk and Blackness” and missed the mark on all three. The original musical director was Gordon Harrell, the last word in pop/funk/jazz-oriented shows (including CITY OF ANGELS, DANCIN’, BIG DEAL, and THE LIFE). The original THE LIFE was co-orchestrated by Don Sebesky and Harold Wheeler. Sebesky was the go-to guy for jazz/big band shows, among a host of others, including PARADE, both KISS ME KATE revivals, both MINNELLI ON MINNELLI and LIZA’S AT THE PALACE, the revivals of BELLS ARE RINGING, BOYS FROM SYRACUSE, FLOWER DRUM SONG, PAL JOEY, the Bacharach show THE LOOK OF LOVE, and more recently COME FLY AWAY, BABY, IT’S YOU, HONEYMOON IN VEGAS, and AN AMERICAN IN PARIS. If only he were still with us – oh wait, he is. Harold Wheeler’s entire career was at the forefront of a host of pop and new styles on Broadway, beginning with PROMISES, PROMISES, AIN’T SUPPOSED TO DIE A NATURAL DEATH, TWO GENTLEMEN OF VERONA, a little skit called THE WIZ (both the original and the revival), LENA HORNE: THE LADY AND HER MUSIC, another little fly-by-night skit called DREAMGIRLS (and its revival), both revivals of LITTLE ME, THE TAP DANCE KID, CARRIE, THE LIFE, SIDESHOW (and it revival), SWING!, those insufficiently gritty, funky, black shows THE FULL MONTY and HAIRSPRAY, DIRTY ROTTEN SCOUNDRELS – and if only he were still with us. Oh wait, he is – his latest show, AIN’T TOO PROUD, having just closed in January. James Sampliner, who executed the re-arrangements of THE LIFE for what they’re still calling Encores, has been Billy Porter’s personal musical director for 17 years, so although his credits pale before those of the above, his presence on the project is not illogical. But if his work is all you say, I’m not sure it’s necessary (or true) to be quite so blithely dismissive of the formidable original team who created the actual show. |
|
| reply to this message |
| re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 12:31 pm EDT 03/19/22 | |
| In reply to: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." - reed23 04:25 am EDT 03/19/22 | |
|
|
|
| I think the main difference for me is that this 2022 version isn’t trying to sound “Broadway” in the way the 1997 version did, and that tension between gritty sex workers and glossy musical was a big part of why the original failed for me. | |
| reply to this message |
| re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." | |
| Last Edit: Chazwaza 01:24 pm EDT 03/19/22 | |
| Posted by: Chazwaza 01:07 pm EDT 03/19/22 | |
| In reply to: re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." - Singapore/Fling 12:31 pm EDT 03/19/22 | |
|
|
|
| Why are sex workers not allowed to "sound broadway"? You know who also sounds broadway? Slaves in Rome in Forum, sex workers in NYC in the 60s in Sweet Charity, 50s street gangs in West Side Story, among others... I'm not saying I don't get why you want them to sing grittier songs based on your understanding of the lives they lead, but I don't entirely think it's fair to bring that to the show as an expectation. The show has a musical language and sound. I also don't think talking about the show as if it's an animated disney musical or Guys & Dolls in skimpier clothing is fair. They sing about some very adult things all throughout the show, and the score may sound old fashioned by not like 1950s or Disney. Yes, they sing in a more neat and written-for-entertainment broadway musical style that some think doesn't work for them, or feels at odds with the setting and realities but also, that's part of why it worked as a musical for the writer of the musical... Billy didn't have to do that writer's musical (and many would say he did not do it). Also, Cy Coleman's score for The Life isn't only a "broadway" sound, there's plenty of R&B in there among other styles... just not funk or disco, and apparently not the "blackness it aspired to", but you'd really have to talk to Cy about what he aspired to (blackness or not), and assigning a certainly specific kind of blackness to how it should have sounded or aspired to sound is a bit weird. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 01:53 pm EDT 03/19/22 | |
| In reply to: re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." - Chazwaza 01:07 pm EDT 03/19/22 | |
|
|
|
| I think Disney is an apt comparison, as it reflects the sanitized, “scruffy” version of Times Square that was created on the Barrymore stage. You’ve also put your finger quite nicely on the way it was that weird hybrid of skimpy Guys and Dolls that also wanted to be adult and taken seriously. I know it wasn’t your intention, but I appreciate how well you’ve captured what I saw in 1997. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." | |
| Last Edit: Chazwaza 03:20 pm EDT 03/19/22 | |
| Posted by: Chazwaza 03:16 pm EDT 03/19/22 | |
| In reply to: re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." - Singapore/Fling 01:53 pm EDT 03/19/22 | |
|
|
|
| Again, that wasn't how everyone saw it or received it or assessed it. And to say The Life is an R&B infused but nonetheless traditional broadway musical score would be accurate, to say that the intentions and tone and style it was written in does not reflect the grit and sadness and misery and extremely frank sexuality of the subject is fair. To say it is basically a Disney musical is bonkers, to say that it is Guys & Dolls in skimpy clothing is silly. But obviously we are both aware how sharply we disagree on this show, and I respect your opinion. But also, you know who wasn't and isn't, to my knowledge, ever a "street walker" sex worker or pimp or drug addicted hustler in 1979 NYC ... Cy Coleman, Ire Gasman and David Newman, or Michael Blakemore, or Billy Porter, or me, or you. And nothing you've said has indicated otherwise. I also do not think the authors would tell you they ever intended to write a show that would be taken as an attempt to accurately portray the lives that real people with equivalent scenarios as the fake characters in their musical are living. This is not what you go to Cy Coleman for. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 03:45 am EDT 03/20/22 | |
| In reply to: re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." - Chazwaza 03:16 pm EDT 03/19/22 | |
|
|
|
| Do you respect his opinion or is it bonkers? I’m lost. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." | |
| Last Edit: Chazwaza 05:08 am EDT 03/20/22 | |
| Posted by: Chazwaza 05:07 am EDT 03/20/22 | |
| In reply to: re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." - KingSpeed 03:45 am EDT 03/20/22 | |
|
|
|
| well, since you asked, i respect him... and that he has one. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 02:53 pm EDT 03/20/22 | |
| In reply to: re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." - Chazwaza 05:07 am EDT 03/20/22 | |
|
|
|
| But you don’t seem to respect his opinion. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." | |
| Posted by: Chazwaza 09:04 pm EDT 03/20/22 | |
| In reply to: re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." - KingSpeed 02:53 pm EDT 03/20/22 | |
|
|
|
| Let me ask you, since you're so interested in inserting yourself here... based on the same series of posts upon which you draw your conclusion about my feelings on his opinion... do you think he "respects" my opinion on this? |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 05:20 pm EDT 03/21/22 | |
| In reply to: re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." - Chazwaza 09:04 pm EDT 03/20/22 | |
|
|
|
| Inserting myself? It’s a public message board. You’re not having a private conversation. And yes, I think he respects your opinion. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." | |
| Last Edit: Chazwaza 05:35 pm EDT 03/21/22 | |
| Posted by: Chazwaza 05:31 pm EDT 03/21/22 | |
| In reply to: re: "The grit, the funk, and the Blackness it aspired to." - KingSpeed 05:20 pm EDT 03/21/22 | |
|
|
|
| I wrote out a reply to this but it's not worth continuing. I think S/F and I are both passionate and intelligent theater lovers who disagree both about this show and, it seems, the reception of it originally and reasons for it being rarely produced since. I am not interested in continuing to debate it, he and I have both made our thoughts on it very clear. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
Time to render: 0.036706 seconds.