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| A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: jeffef 02:41 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| Based on the Tony performance and that I have heard that the show is filthy (buttf**k in the first song lyric) and sex acts on stage, what is the appeal of this show? I found the actor playing Usher weak and the show more for a drag show or a gay bar. Not there is anything wrong with that. I love drag shows but dont need to see it on Broadway. What am I missing? |
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| Thank you all for your answers. | |
| Posted by: jeffef 01:02 pm EDT 06/17/22 | |
| In reply to: A Strange Loop question - jeffef 02:41 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| It comes down to (after going on Youtube) that: A Strange Loop is definitely not for me. Now I know. Different people, different tastes. |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: NYCVoiceTeacher 08:12 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: A Strange Loop question - jeffef 02:41 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| You aren't missing anything. It's an awful show. It won Best Musical and lost best score. To a mediocre show. It's an awful score, and book. The only thing saving it is the performances and energy of the talented actors. The show is AWFUL. A Strange Loop, on it's merits, is awful. And I am a Gay Man. Don't bother going. It is more than filthy. I can handle that. It is degrading to Gay Men and to the main character. |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: seenenuf 08:51 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - NYCVoiceTeacher 08:12 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| From this post, it seems you might be an AWFUL teacher. There is no insight here. No depth. No exploration. Just a rant. Your Opinion writ as Truth. Your post is AWFUL. |
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| Can we please give the meanness a rest? | |
| Posted by: BigM 05:03 pm EDT 06/20/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - seenenuf 08:51 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| The poster disliked the show, and said so. There are no requirements for posting on this board. Some people like to give a full critique, some don't. There is really no reason for this bitchy attack. | |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Last Edit: Chromolume 09:13 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 09:10 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - seenenuf 08:51 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| seenenuf - I tend to agree. But then again, a lot of people don't feel they owe anyone "explanations" on sites like these - it's just their chance to be subjective in the weakest way. But yes - a fuller post with some informed detail about what makes the poster think the show is "awful" is always more worth it. ANYONE can come out here and just say a show is awful, and it really means nothing. Even Genealley has been known to actually go into depth, lol. But yeah, I sure hope that voice students aren't shelling out lots of money to hear this guy tell them simply that they're "awful" or "good." |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Last Edit: WaymanWong 12:40 pm EDT 06/17/22 | |
| Posted by: WaymanWong 12:35 pm EDT 06/17/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - Chromolume 09:10 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| By the same token, there are folks who enjoy posting short raves or quick takes, and they don't feel they owe lengthy ''explanations'' either. See the many positive postings in the ''Romeo and Bernadette'' thread above. No one is being berated for not offering more ''depth'' or ''insight.'' Of course, one can take issue with any rant or rave. That's the nature of message boards. But what seems unfair and unnecessary to me is casting aspersions on a fellow poster's proficiency at their profession because they happen to include their line of work in their signer. |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: NeoAdamite 05:32 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: A Strange Loop question - jeffef 02:41 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| The Tony presentation gives no idea of the underlying story, which is actually a classic one: The hero struggles to transcend his deeply conservative upbringing, in particular the emotional damage it has caused to him (and to some with whom he was close). He does this without self-pity, keeping his sense of humor, and also with an awareness that his parents and their beliefs spring from a complicated cultural context. The show is laugh-out-loud funny when satirizing Tyler Perry's clichés; and more quietly so as Usher considers how "the second wave feminist in me is at war with the dick-sucking black gay man." The Broadway cast album is on YouTube now, and the mix makes it easier to understand the lyrics than on the Off-Broadway version. For what it's worth: the sexual encounter (there is no nudity) is the hero's emotional low point - he has finally accepted he needs tenderness, but Grindr provides only humiliation. |
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| Cast recording | |
| Last Edit: dramedy 06:16 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| Posted by: dramedy 06:15 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - NeoAdamite 05:32 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| I thought only 6 songs from broadway were on line but it does look like there are more. I couldn’t find a link that connects them all in order like the offbroadway cast recording. Does that exist or do I have to hunt for each one in order presented on stage? | |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: Guillaume 05:50 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - NeoAdamite 05:32 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| You should be writing the P.R. for this show. Your post is more compelling than all the flyers hitting my mailbox from the production. | |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Last Edit: Guillaume 04:52 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| Posted by: Guillaume 04:49 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: A Strange Loop question - jeffef 02:41 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| That's my impression of this show also, unfortunately. I've experienced nights in drag bars buttonholed by Divas whose fabulousness turns to lamentation of their lot in life after too many cocktails. This seems like the same thing to me. I don't have the money to spend to go see this to find out that I'm right. I guess a bigger question I have is why is a character who is an usher worthy of our time and what is his "want"? Just being Black, gay and misunderstood doesn't really make me want to pay to join his journey (if there is a journey) because I already support Black and gay values and donate to their causes. So what compelling drive makes this show engrossing to someone who already validates Gay Black men? I don't suppose Usher is a wonderful brain surgeon or neighborhood activist or somesuch similar non self-serving person who is doing something for the greater good, and is being denied the ability to do so because of his life circumstances...? I mean everything I see about this character in clips makes me want to cross the street before he engages me in conversation because he seems SO incredibly self centered and needy and offputting. Lastly, I would not mind a buttf*** lyric as long as it scans and rhymes accurately. Some of the lyrics I've heard from this show have false rhymes and lyrics with the emPHAsis on the wrong sylLAble and that kind of thing drives me up the wall when sitting in a theatre. I'm "old school" that way, as Ryhog will point out! |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: seenenuf 09:36 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - Guillaume 04:49 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| Until you actually see the show, your impression is worthless. Ego driven babble. If you want to be taken seriously, see the show. Then comment. That seems to be old school in the best way. |
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| re: Usher's "want" | |
| Posted by: kidmanboy 07:58 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - Guillaume 04:49 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| Usher's "want" in the show is to be a musical theater writer - and his struggle is to find voice that appeases a potential audience and his own insecurity and guilt stirred up by his upbringing. Whether or not you'll like the show (I liked it, but think it's a bit overpraised when other valuable works closed with much less attention) this is as valid a story to tell as any musical has ever had. | |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: ryhog 06:04 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - Guillaume 04:49 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| You've taken away my work! I am happy, as I am sure you also know, for you to be "old school" in relation to lyrics, if that is your choice. That happiness does not extend to the matters addressed by Ncassidine but I disgress. |
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| "This seems like the same thing to me." | |
| Posted by: Ncassidine 04:53 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - Guillaume 04:49 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| Since you haven't actually seen the show, this is an absurd comment. I'm pretty sure you don't support "Black and Gay values" if you don't think that a musical about a Black, gay man is inherently interesting because it's never, ever done. |
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| re: "This seems like the same thing to me." | |
| Posted by: Guillaume 06:05 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: "This seems like the same thing to me." - Ncassidine 04:53 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| There's nothing absurb about my comment at all. From what I have seen and read IT SEEMS LIKE a skit in a gay bar. And I know the substantial amount of time and money I have donated to Black and Gay causes across this country since the 1970s so I really could not care less about what you think about my commitment to those causes. | |
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| re: "This seems like the same thing to me." | |
| Last Edit: KingSpeed 06:23 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 06:20 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: "This seems like the same thing to me." - Guillaume 06:05 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| What gay bars do skits? I don't care that you donated money to black and gay causes. One can do that and stil be racist and homophobic. Not saying YOU are but merely giving money doesn't absolve you of bad behavior or bigotry. | |
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| re: "This seems like the same thing to me." | |
| Posted by: Guillaume 12:10 am EDT 06/17/22 | |
| In reply to: re: "This seems like the same thing to me." - KingSpeed 06:20 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| Seriously, which gay bar in NYC DOESN'T do drag shows? Lips. Industry. Pieces. Stonewall. Metropolitan. Duplex. Monster. Q. .... ... .. . | |
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| re: "This seems like the same thing to me." | |
| Posted by: jeffef 11:20 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: "This seems like the same thing to me." - KingSpeed 06:20 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| You have obviously never been to New Orleans. | |
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| re: "This seems like the same thing to me." | |
| Posted by: NYCVoiceTeacher 08:19 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: "This seems like the same thing to me." - KingSpeed 06:20 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| This, right here, is one thing wrong with the show. It's a mess of a show. It's all over the place. It has no focus. The score is awful. The book is awful. I have seen the show. If you point it out, you are a racist. So don't try. I don't go to theatre to be absolved. What an awful thing to say. I don't need to be shamed by this mediocre dreg of a show. |
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| re: "This seems like the same thing to me." | |
| Posted by: seenenuf 09:09 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: "This seems like the same thing to me." - NYCVoiceTeacher 08:19 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| A show cannot shame you. But your posts surely can. You should be ashamed for such ignorant and mediocre rantings. They are the dregs. |
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| You should listen to the cast recording | |
| Posted by: dramedy 04:18 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: A Strange Loop question - jeffef 02:41 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| Before jumping to conclusions based on one number at the Tonys. The offbroadway is on YouTube. I’ve listened to it twice because of the issues raised by several about sound at the theater. It doubt it will be a score I listen to often but I wouldn’t dismiss it. | |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: PlazaBoy 03:52 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: A Strange Loop question - jeffef 02:41 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| The number didn't appeal to me, but it doesn't remind me of anything I've ever seen in a gay bar or a drag show. | |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: Ncassidine 03:03 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: A Strange Loop question - jeffef 02:41 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| Uh, what? The appeal of the show is that it's a beautiful musical. And frankly, much more interesting and meaningful than a drag show. |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Last Edit: Ann 02:52 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| Posted by: Ann 02:50 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: A Strange Loop question - jeffef 02:41 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| Based on one song, you found " ... the show more for a drag show or a gay bar"? It's one song. I don't remember there being a drag show element in this show. And I thought the opening number was kind of classic Broadway style. I loved A Strange Loop, with only a quibble or two, and not the ones you mention. It's someone's story (the playwright), their truth. Some of it is very difficult to watch, because sometimes life is not pretty. I'm very happy Michael R. Jackson has succeeded, and I look forward to what he writes next. I doubt writing this was easy, but I'm glad he did. |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 08:56 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - Ann 02:50 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| And I thought the opening number was kind of classic Broadway style. I find there are some definite William Finn influences in the score. And the story (compare Usher to Gordo in A New Brain). There's something rather Falsettos-ish about that opening number, and other spots in the score as well. (And that's praise - I'm not trying to say that Jackson's work is derivative). And I think that style fits this show and there characters - in the same way that it does NOT sound right in the voices of the Peanuts characters as re-interpreted by Lippa, where it makes no sense at all. |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Last Edit: Ann 09:24 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| Posted by: Ann 09:24 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - Chromolume 08:56 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| I am in no way a musician or even a student of music, but the score reminded me of the work of a number of modern-day young musical composers (Title of Show came to mind, even though to some, Jeff Bowen is no longer so young); there is a similar style in that group to my untrained ear. | |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 09:32 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - Ann 09:24 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| Yes - I would agree. | |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: BroadwayTonyJ 09:46 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - Chromolume 09:32 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| I saw A Strange Loop on Fri., 5/20 -- I did like it. It's an interesting show. For some reason the score reminded me of Jonathan Larson's music, from both Rent and Tick, Tick....Boom!. I'm not sure why. | |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: BruceinIthaca 02:48 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: A Strange Loop question - jeffef 02:41 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| Your post is confusing. You say that you saw the Tony performance and have heard of "naughty words" (I believe, it's spelled "buttfuck") and sex acts performed onstage (I assume without nudity--what you see is simulation of sex acts) and the show is more for a drag show or a gay bar? What in it makes it seem like a "drag show" (not the same as having a transgender performer). Do you consider "La Cage aux Folles" a drag show? (I don't--I consider it a show about drag performers--there's a difference) And does it not belong on Broadway. Plus you saw the actor playing Usher for about 5 minutes, during a period when he was still recovering from illnesses that have kept him off-stage for a number of performances in the last few weeks. You don't have to go, and it sounds like you shouldn't, but I would say you "are missing" quite a bit--including basic information. |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: NYCVoiceTeacher 12:50 pm EDT 06/17/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - BruceinIthaca 02:48 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| This show has no comparison to LaCage or Angels in America or any other gay show. I have written in depth about why I don't feel this is a good show. First of all the individual elements. The book is all over the place. There is no focus. The score is repetitive and juvenile. There is no perspective from the main character on his plight. It's incredibly self indulgent and whiny. But the main reason it doesn't work is that the main character.. Usher... is a very confused, and troubled young man. The way it is written we are laughing AT him. He is getting F($cked which is the low point and humiliating... and the audience is laughing because of the way it is written. It did not work for me because Usher is going through a really personal, gut wrenching period in his life... and we are laughing. I certainly wasn't. I was horrified for the character. Usher deserved better. It's a mess in almost every way. |
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| completely inaccurate! (Spoilers but probably should read to correct the previous errors) | |
| Posted by: fm_15 07:53 pm EDT 06/17/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - NYCVoiceTeacher 12:50 pm EDT 06/17/22 | |
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| The scene where he gets "F($cked"is in NO WAY played for for laughs nor are you supposed to be laughing AT him. The only thing "funny" about the scene is the audacity of his partner to say those racist things to him during the act. We're supposed to be shocked by the absurd and preposterous nature of those words and yes, in this way, those words are "funny" because you would not think any sane man would say them. The humor is therefore satirical, not to be taken at face value. "no perspective from the main character on his plight"? The richness of Usher's character lies in how witty and scathing his observations about himself and his world are. Was the ending of the subway fantasy scene where he realizes it's just in his head, an example of "no perspective"? Coming to terms with the falsehood of a fantasy is precisely what it means to have perspective. And how is the book any more "all over the place" than say a show like Company that just jumps from vignette to vignette? It happens in head so naturally it jumps quite fast from concept to concept. Is The Sound and the Fury "all over the place"? Do all stories have to follow a linear progression of plot? I can't quibble with your take on the score being repetitive and juvenile because that is a true opinion but your examples of what happens in the rest of the show is just factually wrong. |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: DAW60 05:21 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - BruceinIthaca 02:48 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| I’m an older, straight white guy and I really enjoyed the show. There is some language used that may bother the more prudish. There is a simulated sex scene, which is appropriate to the moment and is quite heartbreaking-it’s not done for shock value. While the character is specific, many of his issues are universal-someone trying to find his way, despite the voices in his head holding him back, struggling with your home and family vs where you want or need to go…I found it quite moving, and funny. Is it a show for the ages? Probably not-but it’s well worth seeing and certainly deserving of the Tony. | |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Posted by: PlazaBoy 09:46 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - DAW60 05:21 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| I don't think one has to be a prude to not want to hear vulgar language. I am gay man, not a prude, but I don't enjoy vulgar language in the entertainment I chose to consume. It's just not my taste. In the same way that I don't enjoy tv shows/movies that are violent. |
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| re: A Strange Loop question | |
| Last Edit: Chromolume 09:38 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 09:36 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
| In reply to: re: A Strange Loop question - DAW60 05:21 pm EDT 06/16/22 | |
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| There is some language used that may bother the more prudish. Oh, there's a good deal of it lol - even including the "C-word." But I think that's also part of the show's honestly and directness, which, for me, is an incredibly positive thing. (That is to say, the language is there because it's real; it's not there in a gratuitous way.) And as you said, it's also incredibly funny and moving at the same time. |
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