Threaded Order Chronological Order
| ‘To Kill a Mockingbird’ Closes on Broadway as Creators Spar With Rudin | |
| Posted by: Unhookthestars 03:58 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| no message | |
| Link | ‘To Kill a Mockingbird’ Closes on Broadway as Creators Spar With Rudin |
| reply to this message | |
| So should we assume… | |
| Posted by: JAllenC3 06:00 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: ‘To Kill a Mockingbird’ Closes on Broadway as Creators Spar With Rudin - Unhookthestars 03:58 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| That Rudin has also likely reinserted himself into his other shows at this point too? Is he back to calling the shots at Book of Mormon and Music Man? | |
| reply to this message |
| He may not have “rights” in those shows like kill | |
| Posted by: dramedy 06:09 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: So should we assume… - JAllenC3 06:00 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| I think with the lawsuit against the lee estate to even make the stage version is a lot more control over the play than producing those musicals which I’m sure he had a lot of input. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: He may not have “rights” in those shows like kill | |
| Posted by: sirpupnyc 06:44 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: He may not have “rights” in those shows like kill - dramedy 06:09 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| He had the rights to make a first-class theatrical adaptation of the book. So I guess that means he can decline to license it to the Broadway producers for performance. Though as it's quoted, he's stepping in as a producer, saying this isn't the time, it wouldn't be successful. Which, although on paper he may have the standing to stop the resumption of the production, doesn't seem like a licensor's place. If producers have lined up funds they're OK with losing, would MTI or Concord or anybody say "Nah, that won't run, save your money"? And if he *is* beginning to step back in as a producer, I find that distressing. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: He may not have “rights” in those shows like kill | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 08:32 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: re: He may not have “rights” in those shows like kill - sirpupnyc 06:44 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| And if he *is* beginning to step back in as a producer, I find that distressing. Right. All this time they said he was "stepping back" - not "stepping back IN." That said, whatever it is that he's currently stepping IN," I hope everyone else steps OVER. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| The investors are probably better off closing books | |
| Last Edit: dramedy 08:16 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| Posted by: dramedy 08:15 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: re: He may not have “rights” in those shows like kill - sirpupnyc 06:44 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| And getting their portion of the profits. They can fund a new production with rudin out of the picture besides any license fee he is entitled to. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: The investors are probably better off closing books | |
| Posted by: ryhog 10:02 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: The investors are probably better off closing books - dramedy 08:15 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| Let's slow down a little. Rudin has a license, granted by the estate, aka the right-holder, to produce the show. And it's a big fat license. The investors cannot close the books on the show; that's the prerogative of the producer. When Rudin "stepped back," he never said that he had divested. He transferred the lead producership to a buddy. That buddy publicly stated that he hoped a "rehabilitated" Rudin would return to producing. That seems to be what Rudin is doing. The question is: will people work with him? The parallels to the Drabinsky fiasco are striking. I think there is a good chance that 2 of the 3 main theatre owners may not. I think many creatives may not. I think much talent will not. We shall see. It's a sly thing he did here. He did not announce he was going to produce a show. He announced he was not. And he did it on a hot summer day. It's his strategy to get his foot back in the door. Will it work? We shall see. I hope not. That said, I think he made the right call on reopening this show. It would have lost money. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: The investors are probably better off closing books | |
| Last Edit: Chromolume 10:26 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 10:23 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: re: The investors are probably better off closing books - ryhog 10:02 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| The question is: will people work with him? The parallels to the Drabinsky fiasco are striking. I think there is a good chance that 2 of the 3 main theatre owners may not. I think many creatives may not. I think much talent will not. We shall see. In some ways, I tend to think that people are simply a lot less tolerant with offenses than they used to be. There was a time when a lot of folks would still work with people like this because it's show biz, it's good networking, and hey, no one can be good all the time. How long did someone like James Levine get away with things, for instance? His musical talent seemed to excuse everything else. But I remember an interesting exchange with one of my college musical theatre students, just pre-pandemic. She told me she was excited to be seeing some shows in NYC over our spring break (which was the week before things got real serious real fast and the world started closing up). She mentioned Company in particular. I asked if she'd be catching the new West Side Story. And the look she gave me!!! She then explained that no, not as long as Amar Ramasar was in the show, much as she might like to see it otherwise. Meanwhile, Ramasar is now "retired." I doubt really by choice. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: The investors are probably better off closing books | |
| Posted by: ryhog 11:46 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: re: The investors are probably better off closing books - Chromolume 10:23 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| I think what you are pointing out stretches across a wide range of things. People used to tolerate a lot, and hide a lot, and bite their lip a lot. And I think that is changing although it is still surprising when we see people putting up with it (whether it is abuse, bigotry, etc.) | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: The investors are probably better off closing books | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 12:07 am EDT 07/30/22 | |
| In reply to: re: The investors are probably better off closing books - ryhog 11:46 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| I agree. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: The investors are probably better off closing books | |
| Posted by: CCentero 11:27 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: re: The investors are probably better off closing books - Chromolume 10:23 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| One of my students at the Copacabana School of Dramatic Art didn't have a problem with Ramasar in the show. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: The investors are probably better off closing books | |
| Last Edit: Chromolume 11:42 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 11:31 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: re: The investors are probably better off closing books - CCentero 11:27 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| Well goody. Are you a full professor there, or just adjunct? Or maybe just staff? Grad student? TA? | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| I find everything you stated interesting. | |
| Last Edit: dramedy 10:15 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| Posted by: dramedy 10:10 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: re: The investors are probably better off closing books - ryhog 10:02 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| I think you captured what is happening behind the scenes better than i understood it. The only point I disagree with is whether the show has life on broadway. It was still making around $1m a week which is incredible for a play without any really bankable movie star—sorry Harris and kinnear. So I do think it could have returned for another year. And a “tour stop” might get around rudin’s control. But as I said earlier, I expect a national tour will land on broadway for 6 months or more. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: I find everything you stated interesting. | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 12:09 am EDT 07/30/22 | |
| In reply to: I find everything you stated interesting. - dramedy 10:10 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| How would a tour stop get around Rudin? | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: I find everything you stated interesting. | |
| Posted by: ryhog 11:48 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: I find everything you stated interesting. - dramedy 10:10 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| That disagreement is the essence of the game of theatre. It also aligns you with those producers who were apparently ready to move forward until Rudin interfered. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: ‘To Kill a Mockingbird’ Closes on Broadway as Creators Spar With Rudin | |
| Posted by: emmemmkay 04:51 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: ‘To Kill a Mockingbird’ Closes on Broadway as Creators Spar With Rudin - Unhookthestars 03:58 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| This is a little off-topic, but TKAM had a pretty healthy run for a non-musical play - 626 performances. But Harry Potter - albeit in revised/shortened form - recently hit the 1,000 performance mark. The last Broadway play to do that, IIRC, was Brighton Beach Memoirs, which opened in 1983. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: ‘To Kill a Mockingbird’ Closes on Broadway as Creators Spar With Rudin | |
| Posted by: ruff24 04:56 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: re: ‘To Kill a Mockingbird’ Closes on Broadway as Creators Spar With Rudin - emmemmkay 04:51 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| I'll chase this thread as I watch for HP to take a run at 1,222 performances--the record for a Best Play, held by both Sleuth & Torch Song Trilogy. Needs to finish out the year to do so...BBM hit 1,299, also in range... | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: ‘To Kill a Mockingbird’ Closes on Broadway as Creators Spar With Rudin | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 05:05 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: re: ‘To Kill a Mockingbird’ Closes on Broadway as Creators Spar With Rudin - ruff24 04:56 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| How many shows did the original Equus hit? I remember that ran for a long time. I know, I could Google, but figure it adds to the discussion. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| Equus | |
| Posted by: dbdbdb 05:09 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: re: ‘To Kill a Mockingbird’ Closes on Broadway as Creators Spar With Rudin - Singapore/Fling 05:05 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| Equus came in at 1,209 performances, a little less that the other mentioned shows. Although quite the blockbuster run. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Equus | |
| Posted by: keikekaze 09:38 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: Equus - dbdbdb 05:09 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| These are all the Broadway plays that played more than 1,000 performances since 1970: Gemini (1977), 1,819 performances Deathtrap (1978), 1,793 Same Time Next Year (1975), 1,453 Brighton Beach Memoirs (1983), 1,299 Sleuth (1970), 1,222 Torch Song Trilogy (1982), 1,222 Equus (1974), 1,209 Amadeus (1980), 1,181 Harry Potter and the Cursed Child (2018), 1,035 as of July 24, 2022 and still running You'll notice a decided absence of opening dates beginning with either "199-" or "200-"! |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Equus | |
| Posted by: Scottofscott 12:25 am EDT 07/30/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Equus - keikekaze 09:38 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| For some reason, IBDB lists Torch Song Trilogy at 1,230 performances now. I cannot attest that it once listed it at 1,222 because I did not ever look at it. I knew TST and Sleuth both were 1,222 because I'd seen those figures in so many sources. Only discovered this IBDB quirk earlier this year when I ran a search for plays over 1,000 performances. I also find it interesting that the original run of Nicholas Nickleby is counted at 49 performances, because both parts were performed 49 times - but other multi-part productions have been counted by combining parts 1 and 2 or parts 1, 2, and 3 (i.e., Wolf Hall, Harry Potter--during most of its run before it was slimmed down, Angels revival, Norman Conquests, Coast of Utopia). The 1986 revival of Nickleby was likewise counted as only 4 performances a week as had its original version. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Equus | |
| Posted by: emmemmkay 07:44 am EDT 07/30/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Equus - Scottofscott 12:25 am EDT 07/30/22 | |
|
|
|
| The ibdb entry for Torch Song Trilogy explains why it lists the run as 1,230: "The performance count for this production is often erroneously reported as 1,222 and 8 previews; it played 1,230 performances and no previews, having transferred from off-Broadway." | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Equus | |
| Posted by: AlanScott 06:28 am EDT 07/30/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Equus - Scottofscott 12:25 am EDT 07/30/22 | |
|
|
|
| I think the difference between Nickleby and the others was that you could not buy a ticket to see only one part. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Equus | |
| Posted by: mikem 01:15 pm EDT 07/30/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Equus - AlanScott 06:28 am EDT 07/30/22 | |
|
|
|
| On a side note, Coast of Utopia Part 3 may be the shortest run of any Best Play Tony winner. It only had 34 performances counting from opening night (and 13 previews). | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| Coast of Utopia Part III | |
| Posted by: Clancy 02:40 pm EDT 07/30/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Equus - mikem 01:15 pm EDT 07/30/22 | |
|
|
|
| As we left after Part II, I turned to my lovely spouse and said, "Do we have to come back and see Part III?" He said, "God, I hope not!" I said, "I don't know that I've ever loved you more than I do right now." |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Coast of Utopia Part III | |
| Posted by: bmc 08:24 pm EDT 07/30/22 | |
| In reply to: Coast of Utopia Part III - Clancy 02:40 pm EDT 07/30/22 | |
|
|
|
| i saw all three plays on a Saturday;' I made the trip[ to NYC specifically to see COAST; my only disappointment was that coming from Mic h., I couldnt return trilogy a second time | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Coast of Utopia Part III | |
| Posted by: bobby2 04:47 pm EDT 07/30/22 | |
| In reply to: Coast of Utopia Part III - Clancy 02:40 pm EDT 07/30/22 | |
|
|
|
| That was a joke in that Christopher Durang play (forget the name Terrorists and Why we Love Them or something like that) Kristen Nielsen says her friend committed suicide during Coast of Utopia. It was so long she willed her heart to stop beating. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Richard Easton heart attack during Coast of Utopia | |
| Posted by: waterfall 02:20 am EDT 08/02/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Coast of Utopia Part III - bobby2 04:47 pm EDT 07/30/22 | |
|
|
|
| "Kristen Nielsen says her friend committed suicide during Coast of Utopia. It was so long she willed her heart to stop beating." An aside: during a preview performance of CoU, actor Richard Easton delivered the line: "...and that is my final word", headed offstage, then dropped to the ground, having suffered a heart attack. There wasn't a doctor in the house, but a stagehand performed CPR on him until paramedics arrived. Easton recovered and returned to the show, living another decade before dying in 2019. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| I wouldn’t be surprised | |
| Posted by: dramedy 04:26 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: ‘To Kill a Mockingbird’ Closes on Broadway as Creators Spar With Rudin - Unhookthestars 03:58 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| If the tour ends up on broadway in a year or two. I didn’t know that the music box was the intended theater after Hansen closes. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: I wouldn’t be surprised | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 05:07 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: I wouldn’t be surprised - dramedy 04:26 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| I imagine they’re waiting to see how KPop does so they could grab Circle in the Square, but Music Box could be a good theater for a Broadway transfer of Fat Ham. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| Is fat ham considering a transfer | |
| Posted by: dramedy 05:41 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: re: I wouldn’t be surprised - Singapore/Fling 05:07 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| I think it extended twice at the public. It was ok but i didn’t think it was that strong of a play to have a healthy run on broadway. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Is fat ham considering a transfer - YES | |
| Posted by: dreamawakening 08:32 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: Is fat ham considering a transfer - dramedy 05:41 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| EVERY off broadway show wants to transfer to Broadway. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Is fat ham considering a transfer | |
| Posted by: Singapore/Fling 05:46 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: Is fat ham considering a transfer - dramedy 05:41 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| I haven’t heard anything from production sources, but on the ground here in New York, the theater community is expecting a transfer. It’s a big, bold, crowd pleasing show that pushes the form while working within a populist space, and it should appeal in particular to Black and queer audiences. It’d work really well in Circle, where it can maintain its relationship to the audience as a participant, but it could also also be reconfigured for a proscenium house. |
|
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
| re: Is fat ham considering a transfer | |
| Posted by: schlepper 07:54 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
| In reply to: re: Is fat ham considering a transfer - Singapore/Fling 05:46 pm EDT 07/29/22 | |
|
|
|
| Fat Ham wasn't a difficult ticket to get at The Public -- there would be no reason to think it would succeed on Broadway. | |
| reply to this message | reply to first message |
Time to render: 0.123166 seconds.