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| The unsung hero of Les Miz: Herbert Kretzmer | |
| Posted by: TheBroadwayMaven (DavidBenkof@gmail.com) 03:44 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
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| From this week's Broadway Maven Weekly Blast: Though he never got the credit he deserved, wordsmith Herbert Kretzmer was responsible for most of the beloved English lyrics in Les Misérables. A man who once said he was “born under a rhyming planet,” he resented the word “translation” because he felt it minimized his creative contributions. And indeed, many of his lyrics went well beyond translation. For example, the French source material by Alain Boublil and Claude-Michel Schönberg had a stirring song “À la Volonté du Peuple” (“At the Will of the People”), but he found the phrase to lack “passion.” So he turned it into the now-famous “Do You Hear the People Sing?” His lyrics were set to previously composed tunes, but they tended to be re-interpretations (his French wasn’t even all that good.) For example, the words to “On My Own,” “Empty Chairs at Empty Tables,” “Bring Him Home,” and “I Dreamed a Dream” were his. One way to measure the heft of his contributions: the original French version of the show was only two hours long. When he was through with it, it lasted three. You do the math. |
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| re: The unsung hero of Les Miz: Herbert Kretzmer | |
| Posted by: Ncassidine 06:57 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
| In reply to: The unsung hero of Les Miz: Herbert Kretzmer - TheBroadwayMaven 03:44 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
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| 100% agree. Also, Bring Him Home and Empty Chairs at Empty Tables are two of my favorite lyrics in all of musical theatre. | |
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| amen | |
| Posted by: Chazwaza 06:46 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
| In reply to: The unsung hero of Les Miz: Herbert Kretzmer - TheBroadwayMaven 03:44 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
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| I've been saying this since I discovered the show as a teen. I think of all the big smash blockbuster musicals we've had from Miss Saigon to Phantom to Wicked... Les Miz has far and away the best lyrics. |
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| re: The unsung hero of Les Miz: Herbert Kretzmer | |
| Last Edit: pecansforall 06:10 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
| Posted by: pecansforall 06:10 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
| In reply to: The unsung hero of Les Miz: Herbert Kretzmer - TheBroadwayMaven 03:44 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
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| I'm surprised there's been no mention of Trump's use of the song "Do You Hear The People Sing?" at his announcement that he would be running for President again. | |
| Link | Trump - Do You Hear The People Sing? |
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| re: The unsung hero of Les Miz: Herbert Kretzmer | |
| Posted by: HadriansMall 04:59 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
| In reply to: The unsung hero of Les Miz: Herbert Kretzmer - TheBroadwayMaven 03:44 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
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| I am not an expert on the history of LES MISERABLES but wasn't the original French production just a slightly padded presentation of the concept album? Not really a show at all but more of a tableau? Actually adding a fleshed out plot most likely accounts for the bulk of the additional time. | |
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| re: misconceptions about Les Mis in 1980 | |
| Posted by: dlh 03:33 pm EST 11/18/22 | |
| In reply to: re: The unsung hero of Les Miz: Herbert Kretzmer - HadriansMall 04:59 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
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| HadriansMall: I am not an expert on the history of LES MISERABLES but wasn't the original French production just a slightly padded presentation of the concept album? Not really a show at all but more of a tableau? Actually adding a fleshed out plot most likely accounts for the bulk of the additional time. I believe this is a commonly repeated misunderstanding. It's true the 1980 Paris production of Les Misérables has been described as a "series of tableau", but (caution: heresay) while tableaus akin to the barricade-spin in the Nunn-Caird production were a feature of that first staging, the structure and content of the show was very similar to the first English-language version in 1985. All the connective interstitial material was already there. The Trema "concept" recording predated and was not a very accurate document of the stage production. Apropos of the topic, here's a video excerpt from the 1980 production, broadcast by Télévision Française 1 about a week before the show opened. I find this fascinating, language barrier notwithstanding. Alain Boublil et Claude-Michel Schönberg à propos des "Misérables" de Robert Hossein |
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| re: misconceptions about Les Mis in 1980 | |
| Posted by: jo 08:24 pm EST 11/18/22 | |
| In reply to: re: misconceptions about Les Mis in 1980 - dlh 03:33 pm EST 11/18/22 | |
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| Merci bien! Good to see how the original show was presented at Palais des Sports. The original Valjean seemed more like the embodiment of the hero in the literary gem by Victor Hugo. Strong and forceful personality. This was baritone Maurice Barrier. If there were gaps in the storytelling - maybe it was thought unnecessary because LES MISERABLES must have been required reading in school in France! I have read the book and it does have such a complete portrait of life in France in that period of time...as well as a more complete portrait of the major characters. Also, the film adaptation seemed to have incorporated many other passages which the 1985 English version decided to miss ( such as the flight to Paris and how they landed in the convent where Cosette spent her growing-up years, explaining why she grew up gently-raised and where Valjean hid in anonymity from Javert as a gardener ( he was once a tree -cutter in an earlier life). Jackman did portray the stronger & more forceful persona of Valjean! The Crowe seeming indecision of Javert was also likely derived from the characterization in the book. The novel and the show and the film endure - because it is the embodiment of human conditions in many places throughout time. The English version allowed many audiences to appreciate Hugo's eternal story of humanity. |
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| re: misconceptions about Les Mis in 1980 | |
| Posted by: HadriansMall 05:40 pm EST 11/18/22 | |
| In reply to: re: misconceptions about Les Mis in 1980 - dlh 03:33 pm EST 11/18/22 | |
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| Thank you for enlightening me! | |
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| re: The unsung hero of Les Miz: Herbert Kretzmer | |
| Posted by: edinalex 04:50 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
| In reply to: The unsung hero of Les Miz: Herbert Kretzmer - TheBroadwayMaven 03:44 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
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| His credit is as lyricist. | |
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| I’m doing the math. | |
| Posted by: ShowGoer 04:26 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
| In reply to: The unsung hero of Les Miz: Herbert Kretzmer - TheBroadwayMaven 03:44 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
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| “ One way to measure the heft of his contributions: the original French version of the show was only two hours long. When he was through with it, it lasted three. You do the math.” … and it doesn’t add up. He may not have been a fan of the word “translation”, but how in the world does a translator add an HOUR to a show? (And if he DID in fact somehow turn a 2-hour musical into a 3-hour-and-15-minute musical merely through the filter of his own contributions… I’d suggest that isn’t exactly as ringing an endorsement of his talents as an adaptor as you seem to think.) I’m not disputing his role in the show’s success, and I quite like a lot of his lyrics – I just think this summary actually works against the very point you’re trying to prove. |
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| re: I’m doing the math. | |
| Last Edit: royscho 12:28 am EST 11/18/22 | |
| Posted by: royscho 12:26 am EST 11/18/22 | |
| In reply to: I’m doing the math. - ShowGoer 04:26 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
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| Actually, when the show opened at the Barbican, it was 3 hours and 45 minutes, slowly settled into 3 hours and 12 minutes after ~2 years of tweaking prior to the Broadway opening, and about 12 years later was cut to 2 hours and 58 minutes (or so,) when they wanted to stop paying overtime for the Broadway production (which quickly became the standard for all productions around the world.) | |
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| re: I’m doing the math. | |
| Posted by: JAllenC3 04:30 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
| In reply to: I’m doing the math. - ShowGoer 04:26 pm EST 11/17/22 | |
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| Also, much of the new hour was a result of Nunn & Caird working with the original librettist James Fenton. None of his lyrics survive in the show, but he was heavily involved in the restructuring of the show from the French version. | |
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