Threaded Order Chronological Order
| re: Famous Broadway firings | |
| Posted by: ablankpage 09:17 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Famous Broadway firings - toros 08:43 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Yeah, I don't think he was fired but Arthur certainly made his life unpleasant and he probably couldn't wait to get out of there. I do remember Cody Green very suddenly departing the production though. | |
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| More to the 'West Side' story | |
| Last Edit: WaymanWong 07:44 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| Posted by: WaymanWong 07:33 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Famous Broadway firings - ablankpage 09:17 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| ''I don't think he was fired but Arthur certainly made his life unpleasant and he probably couldn't wait to get out of there.'' Laurents had a reputation for his mercurial temper. At one point, Cavenaugh was his golden boy and the director raved about his Tony. Laurents also praised him in his 2009 book ''Mainly on Directing.'' In an interview with the Advocate, he gushed that Cavenauh had ''a depth and passion I suspect he didn't know he had, that exploded during rehearsals.'' Laurents added: ''Matt hits notes Larry Kert couldn't," referring to the actor who originated the role of Tony many years ago. "I really love [Matt]. He's a lovely guy.'' Cavenaugh got an Outer Critics nomination for playing Tony (and a few years later, got a Drama Desk nomination for ''Death Takes a Holiday''). At any rate, his relationship with Laurents got rocky. The director started criticizing Cavenaugh for being too old (even though he cast him). I heard things might've soured after Cavenaugh wanted some time-off for his honeymoon with Jenny Powers. According to a source that Michael Riedel quoted in the N.Y. Post: ''Arthur turned on him. And once Arthur turns on you, it's over.'' I once asked Cavenaugh if he wanted to tell his side of the story, but he declined, and instead took took the high road with the N.Y. Times. |
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| Link | N.Y. Post: 'West Side' Whack (2009) |
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| re: More to the 'West Side' story | |
| Last Edit: Chromolume 11:29 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 11:28 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: More to the 'West Side' story - WaymanWong 07:33 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Laurents added: ''Matt hits notes Larry Kert couldn't" There's only one such note. The long held high Bb in "Maria." (The score includes the optional line that Kert sang, which only goes up to an A - an option many other actors have sung as well - even though the Bb is more impressive, and IMO, actually easier than the alternate line.) Otherwise, Kert sang everything as is, as far as I know. |
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| re: More to the 'West Side' story | |
| Posted by: AlanScott 11:52 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: More to the 'West Side' story - Chromolume 11:28 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Am I wrong or is there a high C at the end of the "Quintet," for them as can hit it? Mike Eldred on the Naxos recording hits some high note there. | |
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| re: More to the 'West Side' story | |
| Last Edit: Chromolume 12:04 am EDT 05/25/23 | |
| Posted by: Chromolume 12:03 am EDT 05/25/23 | |
| In reply to: re: More to the 'West Side' story - AlanScott 11:52 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Yes - but it's also marked optional. And I think not necessary to be honest. Whereas Maria's high C will undoubtedly be heard over everything else, Tony's high C, if he sings it, could easily get lost in the mix (especially if all the Jets and Sharks are singing, not just Riff and Bernardo as written). Unless of course the theatre's A1 or the recording engineer really likes the guy playing Tony lol. | |
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| re: More to the 'West Side' story | |
| Posted by: AlanScott 12:09 am EDT 05/25/23 | |
| In reply to: re: More to the 'West Side' story - Chromolume 12:03 am EDT 05/25/23 | |
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| Thanks! Yeah, I thought it was probably marked optional. But it could be that's another note Cavenaugh that Kert could not have sung. Personally, I think we probably don't want a Tony who sounds too tenory, but Eldred on the Naxos manages that, while nailing that high C (at least I think he sings a high C there), and, yes, the engineers makes sure we hear it. | |
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| re: More to the 'West Side' story | |
| Posted by: tenor1350 11:51 pm EDT 05/25/23 | |
| In reply to: re: More to the 'West Side' story - AlanScott 12:09 am EDT 05/25/23 | |
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| Eldred does sing the high C at the end of the Tonight Quintet, though it's something of a strong mix. Curiously, he takes the lower, Larry Kert alternate notes in Maria. When he very likely could have done the B-flat... | |
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| re: More to the 'West Side' story | |
| Posted by: AlanScott 07:10 pm EDT 05/26/23 | |
| In reply to: re: More to the 'West Side' story - tenor1350 11:51 pm EDT 05/25/23 | |
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| Thanks. I remember that, now that you mention it. It is odd. Perhaps it's because the recording is supposedly presenting the original version. Even though Kert almost certainly did not take the high C, it is perhaps not so definite if you're relying on the cast recording to give the answer. | |
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| re: More to the 'West Side' story | |
| Posted by: PlayWiz 08:02 pm EDT 05/26/23 | |
| In reply to: re: More to the 'West Side' story - AlanScott 07:10 pm EDT 05/26/23 | |
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| Wasn't the story that Larry Kert was hired among other cast members at first as one of the Jets and only found out after being cast (or perhaps at rehearsal) that he had been cast as Tony, the male lead? The creative powers might have felt differently about such things as demanding a high C or sustained Bbs if he had auditioned specifically for Tony and prepared, say, a difficult tenor aria. But apparently they thought he had the right quality for the role that those high notes weren't required of him after all, with Bernstein's approval. | |
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| re: More to the 'West Side' story | |
| Posted by: AlanScott 08:18 pm EDT 05/26/23 | |
| In reply to: re: More to the 'West Side' story - PlayWiz 08:02 pm EDT 05/26/23 | |
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| He is listed as a possible Tony on the list of auditionees dated May 16, 1957, which is out there. Maybe it first appeared on the NYPL digital gallery? Not sure, but it's out there. I think early on he might have been thought of more for Riff than Tony. Anyway, he definitely knew before rehearsals started that he was Tony as it was mentioned in the Herald Tribune on June 3, 1957. |
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| re: Famous Broadway firings | |
| Posted by: twiceroyale 10:00 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Famous Broadway firings - ablankpage 09:17 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Sir john Gielgud from IRENE | |
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| re: Famous Broadway firings | |
| Posted by: Amiens 10:28 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Famous Broadway firings - twiceroyale 10:00 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| And Irene Sharaff was brought in to redesign Raoul Pene duBois' costumes for Debbie Reynolds and later Jane Powell. | |
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| re: Famous Broadway firings | |
| Posted by: duckylittledictum 11:42 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Famous Broadway firings - Amiens 10:28 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Pre-Broadway, all in Detroit: Pleasures and Palaces: Alfred Marks, replaced (briefly) by Jack Cassidy Skyscraper: Victor Spinetti, replaced by Charles Nelson Reilly Step on a Crack: Nancy Kelly, replaced by Pauline Flanagan (to be fair, any of these might have been resignations!) |
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| Robert Morse in WICKED nm | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 03:03 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Famous Broadway firings - duckylittledictum 11:42 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| re: Robert Morse in SHOW BOAT | |
| Last Edit: PlayWiz 04:44 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| Posted by: PlayWiz 04:43 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: Robert Morse in WICKED nm - KingSpeed 03:03 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Robert Morse was also not in the Broadway company of the Hal Prince directed "Show Boat". Apparently Elaine Stritch, playing Parthy, had a lot of influence on Prince and supposedly she didn't get along with Morse, who played Cap'n Andy. Morse was replaced by John McMartin. | |
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| re: Robert Morse in SHOW BOAT | |
| Posted by: larry13 05:13 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Robert Morse in SHOW BOAT - PlayWiz 04:43 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| IF--IF--Stritch was at all responsible for Prince not letting Morse in the B'way. company, then it is a fact she conveniently left out of AT LIBERTY wherein she mentioned Morse admiringly, only as someone also very funny who, like herself, had career problems. | |
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| re: Robert Morse in SHOW BOAT | |
| Last Edit: PlayWiz 08:03 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| Posted by: PlayWiz 07:56 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Robert Morse in SHOW BOAT - larry13 05:13 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Unlike Stritch, Morse had a better Broadway track record, having starred in one smash, "How to Succeed.." and also had starred in "Sugar" which ran about a year, and had appeared in films including of his famous stage hit. Plus he made a great return and won a Tony for his Truman Capote on Broadway in "Tru" in 1989, just about 5 years before the "Show Boat" in question. While famous for "Company", Stritch played a supporting role in its success. Stritch starred in some other shows in NY like "Goldilocks" (and as one of my favorite flops, she sounds wonderful on the OCR), but her track record still wasn't as good as Morse's, which is why at the time of "Show Boat", he seemed to be the bigger star. Morse had a few flops like "So Long, 174th Street" and had also been knocked down a peg perhaps by getting under the title billing when co-starring in the tour of "Sugar Babies" with Carol Channing alone above the title. It is a bit surprising that there didn't seem to be enough comedic/character leading men type roles for Morse during that time. Both Morse and Stritch had personal health issues, too, which may have affected their careers for significant periods of time. | |
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| re: Famous Broadway firings | |
| Posted by: toros 11:45 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Famous Broadway firings - duckylittledictum 11:42 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Faye Dunaway was fired from the Broadway-bound "Tea At Five" | |
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| Mary Tyler Moore | |
| Posted by: chrismpls 10:46 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Famous Broadway firings - Amiens 10:28 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Maybe not exactly fired but, in previews, she received a note from Neil Simon that she needed to learn her lines and then she left. That play practically disappeared. | |
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| re: Mary Tyler Moore | |
| Posted by: pecansforall 11:37 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: Mary Tyler Moore - chrismpls 10:46 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Shortly before she was about to go onstage in an early preview of Simon’s latest play, Rose’s Dilemma, his wife [Elaine Joyce] handed her a letter from the playwright that said, among other things, “learn your lines or get out of my play.” Devastated, Moore quit. | |
| Link | Comedy of Manners |
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| re: Mary Tyler Moore | |
| Posted by: larry13 11:32 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: Mary Tyler Moore - chrismpls 10:46 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Not Broadway but otherwise correct. | |
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| re: Mary Tyler Moore | |
| Last Edit: PlayWiz 12:49 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| Posted by: PlayWiz 12:48 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Mary Tyler Moore - larry13 11:32 am EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Lainie Kazan was also fired from being Barbra Streisand's understudy in "Funny Girl". That fact Kazan at least twice put the press corps on alert ready to review her during Barbra's absence and that she was really good in the role spooked Barbra. Louis Jourdan was fired apparently because Fritz Loewe wanted someone with an excellent singing voice to sing his beautiful melodies, especially the title song in "On a Clear Day". Jourdan, who spoke-sang in the Rex Harrison tradition, supposedly otherwise had great chemistry with Barbara Harris, and he had a good contract where he was paid for possibly the entire run of "On a Clear Day" without having to perform. This was understudy John Cullum's big break, giving him star billing over the title with Barbara Harris. Carolyn Mignini was fired and replaced by Josie de Guzman as Sarah Brown in the early 1990s revival of "Guys and Dolls". Apparently Mignini's chemistry (yes, chemistry!) with Peter Gallagher was found lacking. |
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| Lainie Kazan and Funny Girl | |
| Last Edit: AlanScott 04:47 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| Posted by: AlanScott 04:46 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Mary Tyler Moore - PlayWiz 12:48 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| I think it's almost definitely a myth — one that will probably never die as I think it's in a book or two — that Lainie Kazan was fired as Streisand's understudy. She was in the job for at least a year. She did have a good rep who was getting her lots of publicity as the understudy who had never gone on. Then she got more publicity when she did go on. I think it's a myth that anyone reviewed her. I find no evidence of anyone reviewing her. (The same myth is out there about Jane Romano, Merman's standby in Gypsy.) By the time she finally did get to go on for Streisand, Kazan had gotten enough attention that she was soon playing nightclubs. I think it's quite possible that they didn't renew her contract, but I think it's also possible that she didn't want to renew her contract. In any case, I think it's unlikely she was actually fired. |
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| re: Lainie Kazan and Funny Girl | |
| Last Edit: PlayWiz 05:01 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| Posted by: PlayWiz 04:53 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: Lainie Kazan and Funny Girl - AlanScott 04:46 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| "Funny Girl" opened March 26, 1964 and yet Lainie Kazan is on a Bell Telephone Hour special supposedly recreating her audition for FG which was televised November 24th of that year. That's eight months into Streisand's run -- rather remarkable how an understudy got such a prestigious gig at that time period though unless some of the infamous story was true. I almost always trust your research and knowledge, but that telecast existing is kind of bizarre. Robert Young's intro does mention that the "understudy might one day wind up playing the lead", so I guess she was still in the show. She really had a great PR person and must have had cooperation from someone with power at FG for the right to use those songs on tv! | |
| Link | Lainie Kazan on "Bell Telephone Hour" |
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| re: Lainie Kazan and Funny Girl | |
| Posted by: AlanScott 05:13 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Lainie Kazan and Funny Girl - PlayWiz 04:53 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Thanks for the link. Never saw that before. Interesting, though, that she sings only one song from Funny Girl — one of the two big ones — and then sings from other then-current shows. | |
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| re: Lainie Kazan and Funny Girl | |
| Posted by: larry13 05:08 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Lainie Kazan and Funny Girl - PlayWiz 04:53 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| It MAY be remarkable how an understudy got that prestigious gig BUT since she didn't go on as Fanny until a year into the run, then she did NOT benefit from either the publicity for those performances NOR being(supposedly)fired. She could not have been "fired" in 1964. | |
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| re: Mary Tyler Moore | |
| Posted by: simbo 01:51 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Mary Tyler Moore - PlayWiz 12:48 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Fritz Loewe did not write "On a Clear Day", that was Burton Lane (while Loewe was temporarily retired after the turmoil of the production of "Camelot" - he'd be un-retired in the early 70s for "The Little Prince" movie and the stage version of "Gigi") | |
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| OMG, how did I do that!? - you're right , of course | |
| Last Edit: PlayWiz 04:38 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| Posted by: PlayWiz 04:35 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Mary Tyler Moore - simbo 01:51 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| hitting myself with a wet noodle! Thanks. It was Burton Lane who wanted a better singer as the male lead. I must have had Lerner (who did the lyrics and book) in my mind while I wrote before. | |
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| re: Mary Tyler Moore | |
| Posted by: champagnesalesman 01:09 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Mary Tyler Moore - PlayWiz 12:48 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Lainie was fired from Seesaw and The Women in the same season Christian Hoff left Pal Joey during previews and his understudy, many decades younger than Stockard Channing, took over Eleanor Parker also left Pal Joey(earlier revival) What is it with Pal Joey? |
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| re: Mary Tyler Moore | |
| Posted by: larry13 02:04 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Mary Tyler Moore - champagnesalesman 01:09 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Edward Villella left Pal Joey the day before Parker did! But again, these were not instances of firing. | |
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| re: Mary Tyler Moore | |
| Posted by: JereNYC (JereNYC@aol.com) 01:23 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Mary Tyler Moore - champagnesalesman 01:09 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| But Christian Hoff was injured in early previews, right? Am I remembering that correctly? That's not exactly being fired, at least not in the way this thread is talking about. Same thing happened to James Carpinello in XANADU. Early preview injury and replaced, in that case, by Cheyenne Jackson. |
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| Hoff, then Risch in PAL JOEY | |
| Last Edit: BroadwayTonyJ 02:55 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| Posted by: BroadwayTonyJ 02:54 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Mary Tyler Moore - JereNYC 01:23 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Hoff was injured in early previews, but apparently recovered. Nevertheless, he was replaced. I recall him dancing on some nationally televised TV special to show audiences that he was perfectly fine and should not have been replaced. I think Channing had better chemistry with Matthew Risch than she did with Hoff so there's probably more to the story than what was disclosed at the time. | |
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| On that note, Ron Orbach | |
| Last Edit: KingSpeed 03:56 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| Posted by: KingSpeed 03:54 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: Hoff, then Risch in PAL JOEY - BroadwayTonyJ 02:54 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Ron got hurt during (before?) the Chicago tryout of The Producers. Swing Brad Oscar took over but Ron was back in time for the critics. He got a rave in Variety in fact but by that time, everyone wanted Brad back. Bummer for Ron. He did nothing wrong. | |
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| re: On that note, Ron Orbach | |
| Posted by: Jnf663 05:37 am EDT 05/25/23 | |
| In reply to: On that note, Ron Orbach - KingSpeed 03:54 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| What’s interesting to me about that one is that the video of The Producers that has circulated among collectors for years has Ron Orbach in the show instead of Brad Oscar. So at least for people like me who watched that video countless times growing up, Orbach’s performance has lived on. | |
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| re: Hoff, then Risch in PAL JOEY | |
| Posted by: EvFoDr 03:45 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
| In reply to: Hoff, then Risch in PAL JOEY - BroadwayTonyJ 02:54 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| Risch was (still is?) also the lover of the director which some speculated played into it. Not that Risch isn't talented enough to deserve the role, because I think he is. Also interesting to note that people like Hoff, and Matt Cavenaugh, and maybe others in this thread I don't feel like researching, never worked again in a Broadway show after exit from said show. |
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| re: Hoff, then Risch in PAL JOEY | |
| Posted by: dannyr416 11:12 am EDT 05/25/23 | |
| In reply to: re: Hoff, then Risch in PAL JOEY - EvFoDr 03:45 pm EDT 05/24/23 | |
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| I don't think Risch and Mantello are still together. A few years later though, Risch was Thomas Sadoski's understudy in Other Desert Cities, which Mantello also directed. I saw him go on. I think he was playing the role for an extended period, and he was very solid. Also one again opposite Stockard Channing. He also popped up in that unfortunate Tales of the City reboot on Netflix a few years back, so he's clearly still working. | |
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