re: Various Tony seasons have an asterisk
Posted by: Chazwaza 01:36 am EDT 06/11/24
In reply to: Various Tony seasons have an asterisk - WaymanWong 11:32 pm EDT 06/10/24

It's not that not all Tonys seasons are created equal ... it's that there is one, ONE in Tonys history that is not "a season", but had a competitive Tony Awards anyway. An unprecedented event happened that made this what it was.

I wasn't trying to cite those years to tell you something you didn't know, I was just emphasizing how extraordinary, how completely abnormal and without equivalence the circumstances of the 2020 Tony Awards season was, which led to the 10 TOny wins you boast for Moulin Rouge without any context or footnotes, to support your assessment that the show is a fantastic blockbuster, brilliant at doing what it's meant to do. You love it. I get that. I hated it, you get that. But I think your love for it, if not blinding you to the reality of it, handicaps you from caring to see its Tony wins in the reality they came in.

In all your examples you're also not telling me anything I don't know. I've been through all those "what if x had opened later/sooner" etc examples in my head many times, and with friends, ha.

And I'm sorry, all due respect and love for the talented and delightful Mr. Tveit, but his win is kind of definitively less legit because he was the only nominee. In other years they eliminated the category if that happened. Yes it so happens you loved him in the role, in a show you loved, and I thought that in a stronger year or a in a *full* season he may not have made it to a nomination slot (he likely would, but there have been more egregious snubs in the Tonys past). So we are surely motivated by different feelings and narratives. And the bottom line is we don't know, because no other new musicals or revivals opened that season except Moulin Rouge, Jagged Little Pill, and Tina.
Tveit was given a Tony, which is nice and square... I don't quite agree that it was "won" "fair and square." But we agree, either way, it was not Tveit's fault. It not being Tveit's fault is irrelevant. Of course, you don't agree. And in the end you're right because the Tonys went forward, they nominated him in a category where he was the only nominee, and gave him their award. So my feelings and my arguments about it are irrelevant.

Anyway... Moulin Rouge has given many people lots of gainful employment, and brought many people to broadway. We can never know what would have happened with the Tonys that season *had there been a season*...
But fine, if we pretend this was a normal legit season where it somehow happened that only 3 total musical productions opened in the entire season... then fine. But I still think if it weren't for Covid, Best Actor category would probably have been eliminated for lack of eligible competition, as has happened before (1985 - eliminating Actor, Actress, and Choreography). According to the Associated Press, "The award for best actress, musical was eliminated this season because there was only one eligible candidate," ... ring a bell? They went on "The nominating committee declined to give nominations [in those categories] because they did not consider any of the performances or choreography outstanding or excellent." I do personally believe that 2nd part wouldn't have been satisfied from 2020 had it not been for the goodwill brought by the devastation of Covid being the reason there was only 1 nominee.
I don't have some weird vendetta against him. Again, he's very talented and great in the right role. I know I'm not alone in not finding him compelling in this at all, and finding his singing impressive but acting lacking. On paper this was a good role for him, but it wasn't when i saw him in it. I am happy to blame Alex Timbers their director. Karen is also a huge talent, and I would be saying the same thing if she won for her performance especially against only herself.

Alright, enough of this... I'm glad you enjoyed the show so much.
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